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Removing the Charcoal Canister


Dakmiller

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Ok, so this winter was pretty hard on my undercarriage. The spare tire mount has almost rusted completely off. Rather than replace it, I figure I'll just remove the mount and tire and save about 200+ pounds. Only, I found a problem. The charcoal canister is mounted to the spare tire mount; I would hate to have to weld a new mount up just to save the charcoal canister, so I'm going to take it off. Everyone I ask either doesn't know what I'm talking about, or can't give me an easy straight answer. So What all needs to be done to remove the charcoal canister and keep my truck running smooth?
 


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Tedybear

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Ok, so this winter was pretty hard on my undercarriage. The spare tire mount has almost rusted completely off. Rather than replace it, I figure I'll just remove the mount and tire and save about 200+ pounds. Only, I found a problem. The charcoal canister is mounted to the spare tire mount; I would hate to have to weld a new mount up just to save the charcoal canister, so I'm going to take it off. Everyone I ask either doesn't know what I'm talking about, or can't give me an easy straight answer. So What all needs to be done to remove the charcoal canister and keep my truck running smooth?

I might be totally off in left field. If so I will say "Sorry" in advance.

We are talking the truck in your siggy? The 2006? That truck likely is OBD II with very picky engine controls--including emissions controls that runs the purge valve/solenoid on or near the canister. All parts need to be installed and functional otherwise you'll trigger an evap leak code--and in most cases depending on the state you live in?

You will fail state inspections. NYS as a point has a rule where if the CEL is 'on' when you come in for inspection? You will automatically fail the emissions part of the inspection.

You're far better off heading to a pick and pull yard or some such place and finding decent spare parts to remount everything---or remount the canister in a different place--but careful with the hoses and wiring.

Good luck

S-
 

adsm08

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First, you wont save 200 pounds by removing the spare tire and it's mount.

Second, by removing a frame cross member you reduce frame strength, making the vehicle less safe.

Third, removal of the carbon canister you won't make the truck run poorly, not all the time anyway. You will probably notice a stumble as it leans out while sucking air when it tries to purge the evap system, you will sacrifice fuel economy and have a check engine light.
 

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yank it, charcoal canister is nothing more than trumped up egr bs. as previously stated you MAY feel a slight hiccup but should experience no running or driving issues
 

adsm08

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yank it, charcoal canister is nothing more than trumped up egr bs. as previously stated you MAY feel a slight hiccup but should experience no running or driving issues
Sarge, maybe you should stick to shooting at A-rabs and leave the auto tech advice side of life to those of us who have a clue what we are talking about.

The carbon canister is part of the evaporative emissions control system, which is only related to the EGR system in that it is part of a vehicle.

The EGR system takes small amounts of exhaust gas and uses them to displace fresh air in the intake system to help cool combustion temps and reduce knock, and decrease the amount of fuel needed by putting already hot air into the mix, meaning you need less fuel to get it expanding again. EGR does not always work as advertised.


The EVAP system, of which the carbon canister is a part, has an entirely different function. Gasoline evaporates. That is a pretty simple truth that I think everyone can accept. If you fill your fuel tank, seal it, and the fuel starts to evaporate the system will pressurize. It can build enough pressure to blow off soft rubber seals, like the one around the pump. The evap system catches and stores the vapors made by evaporating gas and keeps the system from building that much pressure.

The evap system has 4 main components, two valves, a purge and vent, the lines, and the canister. The purge valve puts engine vacuum on the system, the vent valve allows a venting of overpressure, and fresh air to flow in during purge. The lines are just like any other line, they direct flow from one end to the other.

The canister is the storage tank for the evap system. It contains and active carbon matrix that will soak up gas vapors and then release them again when fresh air passes over the matrix.

The EVAP system is not "trumped up EGR BS" as the good Sargent claims, but is rather the one emissions system that can only improve fuel economy. The stuff it catches will be lost to atmosphere one way or another. If you just remove the canister you leave an open line from the tank, and you will lose fuel to evaporation and have a constant gas smell around your truck. Even if you cap that line the fuel cap has a blow-off valve in it for emergencies, and once 5 or 10 PSI builds in the tank it will still vent itself, and the fuel pump pumps liquid, not vapor, so you will loose the rest when you pop the cap to fill her up.


Sarge, take your hatred of government and emissions and go learn stuff instead of being paranoid.
 

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adsm08, first of all i will admit without hesitation that i was wrong when i said " yank it, blah, blah, egr bs" i understand entirely too well how an EVAP system works and now thank the lord all of the fine folks reading this will too after your lesson. secondly, i do not hate the government in fact i am a big fan, ive been able to do some wild things thanks to uncle sam and tax payers $$$$$, i am also far from paranoid; that is actually laughable. lastly maybe i should "stick to shooting at a-rabs" as you so eliquently put it and in that same thought maybe you should watch your mouth? no internet tough guy crap im just thinking that someone held in such high regard here should probably not speak to things YOU know nothing about and leave the "shooting at a-rabs" and protecting your right to be an internet douche to those of us who have a clue what we are talking about.
 

Dakmiller

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Sarge, maybe you should stick to shooting at A-rabs and leave the auto tech advice side of life to those of us who have a clue what we are talking about.

The carbon canister is part of the evaporative emissions control system, which is only related to the EGR system in that it is part of a vehicle.

The EGR system takes small amounts of exhaust gas and uses them to displace fresh air in the intake system to help cool combustion temps and reduce knock, and decrease the amount of fuel needed by putting already hot air into the mix, meaning you need less fuel to get it expanding again. EGR does not always work as advertised.


The EVAP system, of which the carbon canister is a part, has an entirely different function. Gasoline evaporates. That is a pretty simple truth that I think everyone can accept. If you fill your fuel tank, seal it, and the fuel starts to evaporate the system will pressurize. It can build enough pressure to blow off soft rubber seals, like the one around the pump. The evap system catches and stores the vapors made by evaporating gas and keeps the system from building that much pressure.

The evap system has 4 main components, two valves, a purge and vent, the lines, and the canister. The purge valve puts engine vacuum on the system, the vent valve allows a venting of overpressure, and fresh air to flow in during purge. The lines are just like any other line, they direct flow from one end to the other.

The canister is the storage tank for the evap system. It contains and active carbon matrix that will soak up gas vapors and then release them again when fresh air passes over the matrix.

The EVAP system is not "trumped up EGR BS" as the good Sargent claims, but is rather the one emissions system that can only improve fuel economy. The stuff it catches will be lost to atmosphere one way or another. If you just remove the canister you leave an open line from the tank, and you will lose fuel to evaporation and have a constant gas smell around your truck. Even if you cap that line the fuel cap has a blow-off valve in it for emergencies, and once 5 or 10 PSI builds in the tank it will still vent itself, and the fuel pump pumps liquid, not vapor, so you will loose the rest when you pop the cap to fill her up.


Sarge, take your hatred of government and emissions and go learn stuff instead of being paranoid.
I agree with most of what you're saying. Except for, 1. I will save 200lbs. I already removed the tire to try and keep the mount from completely breaking off, and I felt how heavy the mount and crank and canister are, combined I will save 150-200lbs. 2. The spare tire mount doesn't appear to be a frame crossmember; there is no way that a thin piece of metal that is hanging below the frame could be a major structure point. Im pretty sure that's what the large crossmember above the axle and at the rear of the bed are there for. 3. I have had quite a few knowledgeable people who say that the charcoal canister does very very little for your fuel economy. Also, here in Michigan im 98% sure we don't have any emissions laws other than requiring a catalytic converter. Another piece of information, the overflow line from the gas tank to the canister broke off, so i'm already pulling vapor codes and I'm not getting any worse gas mileage then when the truck was new.
 

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Andy D

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Take away all the rotten metal you want. Leave canister and plumbing in place tied to something that is staying with wire or cable ties,etc. It is easier to keep the system stock, than to deal with the work arounds needed when you delete stuff. :D
 

Tedybear

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Issue to be mentioned "Already pulling codes". At this time you know it's that code. Yes it trips the light. However if your truck had/has another issue, you'll never know it because the light is already 'on'. Unless the driveablity goes down the drain--quite a few times before the truck/car goes "limp" it will trigger a code before it gets that bad.

It's easier just to fix the line and return the system back to stock, then to argue back and forth.

S-
 


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