Questions about 1999 B3000

[RonD]

Yes, they need to erase ALL keys, then add the ones you have back

Same for FOBs(keyless entry) but you can do that yourself and erasing of all FOBs is automatic, meaning when you go into Programming mode that erases ALL Fobs in memory, then you have to add back all the Fobs you have
So have all Fobs handy when programming

 

[James Morse]

@fastpakr OK, thanks, I don't understand why, if you used cloned keys with the same code, that it prevents you from making new ones using the factory procedure later? Seems like there would still be 7 available "slots" for the codes, in the vehicle. I'm missing something. Sorry. I feel like a dunce.

I do understand that if you have two keys the same, and you lose one, then you have to do what I'm faced with now. I mean, not exactly the same, because I suppose the lost key had a different code, but it still forces you to clear codes and reset to new ones.

Actually even if you have two keys different and you lose one you still have to clear the code for at least that key. That's probably my situation right there. I suppose "they" can tell which code is for the key you have remaining but it sound easier to just clear everything and start over.

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a) I have another stalk on my steering column under the wiper/high-low/turn signals stalk. It for sure looks factory, the cutout for it in the column's plastic sheathing is obviously molded for it. Wtf is that? It doesn't seem to do anything, and I don't see it in my owner manual at all. It has a small amount of travel forward/back, that's it, no up/down or turning or anything.

b) Radio works great but CD gives "Disk... err" so I'm going to try cleaning the thing that reads them, if I can get to it, with alcohol. Haven't done it yet. I guess that's the normal approach, unless you guys know otherwise. Not that big a deal but you know how it is you get a used truck you start going over it and make list of what doesn't work.

THANK YOU.

 

[don4331]

a) 2nd stalk under the steering column is for tilt.

In layman's terms: If you have 2 keys with different codes, the PATS assumes you are the owner and will let you program a 3rd, 4th, etc key. But if you only have cloned keys, PATS sees the 2 keys as same and doesn't "grant" you additional functionality that it would to an owner. PATS - Passive Anti Theft System

It is preventing the individual at the local lube store or similar from making a copy while you have a coffee.​

Same reason it would take about 30 minutes to reset 2 keys - the FORSCAN application has a time delay, to prevent a thief from quickly making a key and driving off with your truck.​

​

p.s. Decent looking truck.

p.p.s. Often the driver's door lock and ignition tumbler get worn far more than passenger's door lock. To the point the key doesn't work in passengers. If you hold your tongue right and do the proper jig, the key will unlock my '99's passenger door. But more often, I have to walk around to driver's to let myself in.

 

[James Morse]

@RonD and don4331 Ah, about the stalk, and AHH about the keys, now I get it. Thanks. This will help me in talking to B&D Lock. Should be able to get it right. I'll remember to tell them, make sure these two keys have different codes and make sure you clear out any existing codes before you put them in. That SHOULD do it.

Are you saying that with cloned keys some jerk can make another cloned key and it will work, but, if they are different, then, they cannot do this? Or is it the other way around, that I -want- the cloned so they can't do it? Just to make sure I'm still on the beam here. I am so sorry if I sound like an idiot.

I kind of thought the little stalk might be tilt, I didn't see it (steering wheel) wanting to move, but, maybe it's just been in the same place so long it's stuck. I just didn't want to force anything.

Yeah zero rust at all even in places you'd expect it. On body, I mean. Frame rails get rusty, exhaust, all that, but all seems solid. Interior not perfect but for 190k miles, pretty darn good. No rattles. Thanks. Has the one dent, I think paintless might be able to fix that. Front bumper kind of messed up, not real noticeable. Not sure if I can get that, probably expensive if I can and probably ones in junkyard would mostly be fubar. The truck doesn't have all the options but it does have the stock Mazda embossed Duraliner and the alloy wheels, and cruise (though buttons need to be replaced), and a/c (cold), I think those were options. I kind of wanted 4x4 but given that the rest of it seemed pretty good I went with it. At least ground clearance is huge so I can go over rough roads, just, can't go everywhere a 4wd can. Not sure if you can retrofit for that, probably would be a nightmare and not worth it for the amount I'd use it. I'm just thinking of one time I was going up a mountain road, fire road basically, and it was real dicey, ditches, huge rocks and holes, etc, and I got almost to the top in my Saab Aero and finally gave up just short of the top. A guy in a 4x4 was coming down, and he was looking at me like I was nuts because the Aero has like about 4.5" clearance and spoilers hanging down etc. I managed to puzzle my way through that but, never again, that's just foolish.

The truck's visibility is awesome, that's a big plus, and all kinds of places to put your stuff, that's cool. It's kind of in a way a classic, yet parts should be easy to get because of the Ranger crossover on most parts, as I understand it. I'll get more pics soon now that I actually have it. Love cruising in it. First truck I ever had.

I'm thinking tonneau cover might be nice, that has to be a whole lot cheaper than a top, and then if I got stuff (dog food, lumber, hay, etc) and it started raining I'd be ok. Is that something I can just get and put on or would I have to do something else? I don't think I want to install a bunch of snaps and stuff, there has to be another way to do it.

Stake sides might be cool, not sure why I'd want them, but it has the holes there to put them in, at least I assume that's what those rectangular cutouts on top are. I could make that pretty easy, I have a wood shop. I'm trying to think why would a person ever want to do that. Maybe if they wanted to take a whole lot of brush to the dump or something like that. Or maybe just to look different? I can't recall ever seeing a pickup with stake sides.

Thanks for tip on the passenger side lock. I haven't worked with it much, experience has taught me go gentle on stuff, lots of times thinking more force will do it, just breaks something then it's worse than it was before when it might have been fixable. Nice thing is, if you have to take it out, very easy, unlike so many other vehicles.

I don't have fob because it doesn't have that option, however, thank you, I'll keep that in mind. No power mirrors or locks or windows, which is ok with me, less stuff to break. They are nice, though, if you have them.

Thanks very much for all the help.

 

[fastpakr]

The factory programming procedure requires you to present two unique keys. This prevents someone (valet for example) temporarily having one key and using the process to make their own for later use.

With only one key currently in the system, there are two options. 1) Clone your current key (preventing you from making a future key because you'd still only have one key the computer would see if you started the normal process found in the owners manual that requires two). Or 2) Using special programming tools that connect to the PATS module through the OBD2 port. That procedure wipes all existing keys and then instructs you too present the keys you want to use in succession to the receiver by the ignition cylinder so the module can learn them.

 

[James Morse]

Fastpakr - ok, thanks again.

I don't know what B&D did, but it sure sounds like they didn't do the factory programming procedure because, of course, I didn't have two keys. Sounds like they read the code of the one key I had, then just made one identical to it. Or it's not identical, but they have tools to bypass whatever they want.

So what I need to do is tell them, "I want you to clear all existing codes in the truck, and I want you to program TWO UNIQUE KEYS."

Have I finally got that right? It's starting to sound like it would have been easier to take you up on your offer!!

Should I ask them for the codes they use or is that just not useful to me?

I'm still mystified how they went ahead and made the second key without two keys and didn't even ask for ID or title or anything. I'm guessing they have tools that can do whatever they want. Which they'd have to have or I'd be up the creek as far as getting a second key of any kind.
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My owner's manual says "Your vehicle has one key..." (p. 2-2) that opens everything. Take the plate attached to the key and store it and write the code down and save that.

I never heard of a vehicle coming with just one key. Seems like they should have said, you get two keys, one opens everything and the other opens just the doors and ignition but not the glove box. Maybe it was a typo. Just can't be right.

In the olden days you got two keys, one opened everything and the other "valet" key opened the doors and ignition, but it didn't work on the locking center console or on the trunk. That was way before PATS. Then you could leave stuff in the glove box or trunk and valet couldn't open them. You carried both keys and when you went travelling you took the valet key off the ring, gave it to them to use, and kept your other key.

Part of the problem was I talked to one guy on the phone, but they have a slew of people there and they are busy so that conversation might as well never happened. Their policy should be, ask the customer, are you missing any keys? Then they should wipe old codes and start fresh with new codes. If not missing keys, don't wipe the codes, just add 3rd, 4th, whatever. And don't make keys that duplicate codes already in there. Makes sense?

If the person later finds the missing key, it of course wouldn't work, but it could be added back.

 

[fastpakr]

Did they have your original key, plus a new one they were making, plus your truck to do the programming? If so, then they probably did the procedure you wanted.

If they only had your original key but not your truck, then they cloned the key (that doesn't require the truck).

I probably haven't explained this well. There are basically three total options:
1 - you as the customer can add a new key to the truck's system. I don't remember the details, but the instructions should be in the owners manual. You put in two unique PATS keys to prove you're the owner, then the system is ready for you to add additional keys.

2 - the OEM procedure that a dealer or a locksmith would do (and someone with Forscan can do now that the tool exists). This erases everything in the system, and only works if you present two unique keys to program in. B&D could have used your current key plus the new one they were giving you as the two unique keys, assuming they had your truck to work with.

3 - the aftermarket procedure where a locksmith somehow scans your key and programs a new key to be logically identical to it. Because it and your original key look the same to the PATS system, it precludes you from doing procedure 1 in the future since you still only have the one key that the computer can see.

RonD can probably elaborate on this a bit...

 

[James Morse]

Yes they had my one key, plus they provided the new key blank and cut it and the truck was there and I know they went out to the truck with some electronic device in their hand.

But when I called about it afterwards they were like, ok, maybe we didn't understand what you wanted, we didn't know you had missing key, bring it up, we'll make it right (no add'l charge).

I have zero in my owner's manual about adding keys, at least not under "Keys". What year are you looking at? (mine's '99).

I'm pretty sure from what you said that I want option 2. Clear out everything, and since I have two keys, they should be able to write two different codes to them and present these two unique keys to the truck and program them in. Then I don't worry about lost keys, and if I want to add more keys later, I can. I'd go up with the two keys and tell them, with these two keys you should be able to easily add a third (or if there's a way I can do it myself, then, I would).

Probably what they did is option 3. Otherwise they wouldn't have said come back up there. Chances are there is another code in the truck that matches a key that I don't have, and that is what I want to eliminate, as well as being able to add more keys later. Chances are, they just made a copy of the key I did have. Not what I wanted at all, knowing what I (think that I) know now.

Part of the confusion was that in my ignorance I was thinking, I want two different keys in case there are smart features (speed limiting, etc), then I'd definitely want different codes. Then when they said, you don't have that, those features came out about ten years after your truck was made, I said well then just make a key that works. Knowing what I know now I would have told them do option 2. Since I have the two keys, they should be able to do that, clear the codes in the truck, write new unique codes to the two keys, and then add them in "slots" 1 and 2 in the truck's system.

Now... if I go up there and they tell me, we did clear all the old codes and we did put in two new unique codes, well, then I'm done. But it didn't sound like that or they wouldn't have said come back up.

Hope I am finally getting it. Thanks fastpakr.

 

[fastpakr]

It's possible that it's not actually written in the owners manual. Here's the procedure in case it's not in the book:

1999 Ford Ranger Ignition Transponder Chip Key Programming Instructions

How to Program a 1999 Ford Ranger Ignition Transponder Chip KeyStep by Step How to Programming Instructions: Transponder system was standard with V6 En

www.programautokeys.com

I'm not sure what they did at this point. I agree that option 2 is the best. You might consider getting a third key made while you're dealing with all this and storing it in a safe place in case you ever lose one.

 

[James Morse]

Yeah. I'm about to go up and get it straightened out. Thanks.

I'm the only driver, but you know what, that might be a good idea about the third key as added insurance.

If I had them cut the blank ($20) for the third key, it looks like the instructions on the link say I can put it in the system myself. I printed the instructions out.

Plus that would prove if they did it right. Because you can't put the 3rd key in without having the two unique keys.

Very cool. Probably worth the 20 just to know all is working as desired, whether I feel like I need the 3rd key or not. In fact, I could do that right there and if it didn't work then I could ask them, what gives.

This is really helping me.

I wonder if the 3rd key will have a default code already in it. Because if they say they have to put in a code then it'll be another 40 probably. I want to see it work using the instructions you gave me.

 

[RonD]

There is no "work around" for PATS, wouldn't be much of an Anti-theft system if there was
Not even a Ford Dealer can by-pass PATS, let alone a locksmith(or a thief)

You can't simply "type in" a new key "number" to PATS memory

Forscan is a Laptop software that can add PATS keys, it is similar to the Ford software
You need a code that is generated by PATS module when you request access to PATS, and that code is run through a Ford algorithm to generate another code that must be sent back to PATS module to confirm you are an "authorized" user

Once you have "authorized" access you can insert a key that PATS will store as the "master" key and at that point all other keys in memory are erased
Then you have to insert a 2nd PATS key with a different "number", this is required, not optional
Must have 2 key "numbers" in memory as a minimum, but you can also add a 3rd and 4th key if you want, but 2 is minimum

How-to here: https://forscan.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=839


For Cloning a key, the locksmith just needs a working PATS key, no access to vehicle
Key is cut for the lock, then "number" is copied and written to the new key


Yes, if you have 2 different keys that are already programmed into PATS memory then you can add a 3rd or 4th key yourself
A cloned key is not a 2nd key as far as PATS is concerned, same number so same key not a different key
Adding keys this way doesn't erase previous keys in memory

 

[fastpakr]

Ron, for what it's worth there is a way to bypass early generation PATS systems that was discussed/tested/confirmed at another forum recently.

 

[RonD]

That would be interesting
So no intercepting of key data like remote start systems, it actually eliminates PATS test, without having any keys available

 

[fastpakr]

Yep. Basically bypassed it on the back end somehow. I didn't pay a lot of attention at the time since mine works fine but I should bookmark it for later reading. I'll PM you a link if I can find it quickly.

 

[James Morse]

Hi guys, well, here's the story. I went back up there. Guy who did it told me, he saw only 1 "slot" used in the truck before he put in the new key I bought yesterday, which went to slot 2. I said, if that's true, then I should be able to get a cut blank from you for 20 and I should be able to put it in as a third key by myself and he says yes that should work. So I put the 20 for the 3rd key. I go to the truck, and thought I was following the directions, but ended up with NO keys working at all. I totally bolluxed it somehow. So I go back in thinking, I'm in a world of sh*t now. Then, who I assume is the boss guy comes over and says let me see those keys. He goes out, sets in the truck, and doing basically what the directions say, gets all three keys to work in no time at all - first key in, second key in, third key - like that. That tells me, yeah, the two I had were in fact unique keys, otherwise that wouldn't have worked, as I understand it. Is there another key floating around that can start it? It would seem not. In any case, that key has probably been gone a long time. He said he wouldn't spend much time worrying about it. He talked to me a little and he says, these are some of the first PATS systems, they can be balky. Sometimes you can't get 8 in you can only get 6. The newer programming devices, after say '04, may not even work on them because they are way faster than the old ones and the truck's computer doesn't respond fast enough. Anyway, he got all 3 keys working very easily, and if I want another key (lord knows why I would) I could get it there and if I f'ed it up again he'll do it. Process was exactly as instructed, he just had the "touch" for it.

So they told me, there wasn't another "slot" used, implying to me, there was no other key "out there" that would work. However, if a person wanted to make absolutely sure of that, they could buy enough keys to cycle the thing through until all the slots were used, which would wipe anything else that may have been there. Probably overkill, but it actually would cost you like 100 to do that (5 keys x 20/key).

Oh - lastly - if keys are cloned, and I still don't really understand that - is it possible there is a key that would work still (say, all slots are filled, but one is the old key, and maybe there is a clone of it). I just don't understand clone I guess. Anyway, the ones I have aren't clones or he wouldn't have been able to get that 3rd key to work.

Really cool. I think it's fixed and working per the way it is supposed to work. If anything I said sounds otherwise, let me know and MANY THANKS to all.