• Welcome Visitor! Please take a few seconds and Register for our forum. Even if you don't want to post, you can still 'Like' and react to posts.

new roller rockers + interference 2000 flex


pjtoledo

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2007
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
2,914
Points
113
Location
Toledo Ohio
Vehicle Year
20002005199
Make / Model
Fords
Engine Size
3.0 2.3
first off, is the 2000 flex 3.0 an interference engine??? 'cause I'm having issues.

was running OK at 117,000 so I'm leaving the bottom alone, heads are still on.
it leaked a lot, so I did what 'ol retired guys do and pulled the engine for easier access.
it's on a stand, intake off, good view of the cam & lifters.

bought a set of SBF 1.7:1 roller roller rockers, time to see if they fit.

loosened all the rockers & removed pushrods. timing chain is now off so I can spin the cam by hand.
all the pushrods were tight, engine hadn't been run for months, the springs in the lifters were keeping tension.
new cam pedestals are only a couple thousands narrower that stock, close enough.
kit bolts are 5/16, found some CV bolts from an 82 VW that are only 5 threads shorter. good enough for a test fit.
you'll need 8mm x 1.25 -50 allen head bolts for the correct fit, grade 10.9

crank at TDC, removed #1 exhaust spring, bolted the new rocker on,,,,, now the issues begin.
there is at least 1/8 inch between the valve tip & roller. so much for a direct bolt-on. if push the rocker down it contacts the stem correctly.
with no spring I was able to move the valve and check, it would drop just below the stem wear area then hit the piston.
rotated crank a few degrees L & R, yep valve started to drop so I know valve was on the piston.

then I checked for lift, rotated the cam by hand, it took up the 1/8" gap then pushed then valve down enough to hit the piston. ?????
repeated several times. yep, the new 1.7 rockers push the valve into the piston even with 1/8" valve lash. major bummer.
notched pistons are not in the plan, nor the budget.

here's where it gets weird: put the stock rockers back in, (spring still missing) snug it down and give the cam a spin.

the freaking valve still hits the piston!!!!

either this is an interference engine or there should be a hellava lot of preload on the lifters.
any ideas?

maybe tomorrow I'll put a degree wheel & dial indicator on it and find some weak springs to test with.
 


Uncle Gump

Token Old Guy
TRS Event Staff
TRS Forum Moderator
Supporting Member
VAGABOND
TRS Event Participant
Joined
Sep 17, 2018
Messages
13,710
Reaction score
13,166
Points
113
Location
Ottawa IL
Vehicle Year
2006/1986
Make / Model
Ranger/BroncoII
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC/2.9L
2WD / 4WD
4WD
My credo
Lead follow or get out of my way
I have used some roller rockers that require a "lash cap" over the tip of the valve and also require custom length push rods. This would explain the 1/8" clearance between the rocker and valve tip.

I'm not positive if it's an interference engine or not... But it probably is. As far as the valve hitting the piston at full lift with either rocker arm... that's normal if the piston is at TDC and valve goes to full lift.
 

Uncle Gump

Token Old Guy
TRS Event Staff
TRS Forum Moderator
Supporting Member
VAGABOND
TRS Event Participant
Joined
Sep 17, 2018
Messages
13,710
Reaction score
13,166
Points
113
Location
Ottawa IL
Vehicle Year
2006/1986
Make / Model
Ranger/BroncoII
Engine Size
4.0L SOHC/2.9L
2WD / 4WD
4WD
My credo
Lead follow or get out of my way
I would see if you can locate a cam card for your cam... then put a degree wheel on it with the timing chain in place. and see what you get. I still think you will need custom length push rods to get you rocker geometry correct.
 

pjtoledo

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2007
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
2,914
Points
113
Location
Toledo Ohio
Vehicle Year
20002005199
Make / Model
Fords
Engine Size
3.0 2.3
I didn't have time to really examine the geometry yet, that is the angle between the stem and rocker.
the tip travel looked OK, started on one side and swept to the other while staying way from the edges.
cutting these pedestals down won't work as the height of the base is barely more than the excess gap.
that would leave them too narrow.
a little voice inside me is saying "adjustable studs" but these heads are metric and I'm not sure there are any 8mm metric SBF studs.

I'll get the dial indicator out to find the actual lift, X 1.62 and X 1.7, then bounce the valve off the piston to find available travel.
so far I've only checked the exhaust of #1, probably should do a few more to be sure.

the cam is factory, doubt there is a card for it.
and yes I know the Ranger has a different cam than Taurus'.

anybody have an engine spec page?
my 1995 Taurus books have the 3.0 info but it differs a bit from the Ranger versions.
 

19Walt93

Well-Known Member
Ford Technician
V8 Engine Swap
Joined
Nov 13, 2018
Messages
4,475
Reaction score
4,412
Points
113
Location
Canaan,NH
Vehicle Year
1993
Make / Model
Ford Ranger
Engine Type
V8
Engine Size
351
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Drop
3"
Tire Size
235/55R16
My credo
If you don't have time to do it right will you have time to do it over?
I have a friend who works at Napa, he's printed me cam specs for several stock cams. Know anybody at Napa?
 

stmitch

March 2011 STOTM Winner
MTOTM Winner
2011 Truck of The Year
Joined
Jan 29, 2010
Messages
2,259
Reaction score
615
Points
113
Location
Central Indiana
Vehicle Year
2000
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
3.0
Transmission
Manual
The 3.0 is NOT an interference engine.
I did a clay test when I built my engine, and with the 1.8 roller rockers, there was still over .25" of clearance between the piston and the valve. I say "over .25 inches" because that's how thick my clay was and the valves didn't put a mark on it. (engine fully assembled, turning the crank by hand)

I'm not sure what you're really trying to achieve? Just tinkering? Why does it matter if the valve hits the piston when there's no spring installed? It just seems like a ton of time, effort and work when Morana sells bolt on rockers that can be installed without any of that. For what it's worth, I'm 99% certain that Morana's roller rockers are aftermarket GM LS rocker arms with custom pedestals.
 

pjtoledo

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2007
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
2,914
Points
113
Location
Toledo Ohio
Vehicle Year
20002005199
Make / Model
Fords
Engine Size
3.0 2.3
over due for an update. I'm mostly tinkering for now.

put a dial indicator on, added 0.090" shims under the pedestals to correct geometry issues and cobbled up an adjustable test pushrod.

with Proform 1.7 SBF rockers the valves just barely touch the pistons when the lifters are fully extended.

so any lash/compression of the lifter will give 1.7 times that as clearance between the valve & piston.


where I ran into the surprise interference with the stock parts turned out to be a wear pattern on the stock rockers.
normally the lifter would be compressed for lash and that determined how far the rocker traveled. there are wear "ridges"
in the rocker from the grooves in the stock pedestals. they acted as a "stop", sort of.

with the lifters fully extended the rockers traveled farther than normal and hit the "stops" (ridges)
since the chain was off and I was turning the cam by hand without much force I thought the valves were now hitting the pistons.

later I found that with more force I could rotate the cam & rockers past this "stop". actually, after going over the "stop" a few times
it sort of flattened out and went away. normal valve train movement resumed.
 

Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Staff online

Today's birthdays

Member & Vendor Upgrades

For a small yearly donation, you can support this forum and receive a 'Supporting Member' banner, or become a 'Supporting Vendor' and promote your products here. Click the banner to find out how.

Truck of The Month


Kirby N.
March Truck of The Month

Recently Featured

Want to see your truck here? Share your photos and details in the forum.

Follow TRS On Instagram

TRS Events

25th Anniversary Sponsors

Check Out The TRS Store


Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Sponsored Ad


Amazon Deals

Top