Must you completely remove carrier to set pinion preload?

[sickwilly]

My thought was maybe the carrier could be pried out far enough to disengage from the pinion gears, by leaving bearing caps loose but still bolted so carrier wouldn’t just fall out, so i could set pinion preload properly without having to completely remove the carrier. Apparently they’re in pretty tight and may be a b**** to get back in. Probably not possible, that’d be too easy. Thought i’d ask anyway. Thanks

 

[Dirtman]

I assume you have an 8.8? I've never had an issue getting the carrier in and out. Box end wrench on a ring gear bolt then turn the pinion nut to remove, dead blow to put it back in.

 

[sickwilly]

7.5 open if it makes a difference. I just got the impression they are sometimes pretty tight and was just trying to avoid the hassle of tryin to force it back in while lying on my back/side since im workin on a dirt floor with the truck on jack stands. Not really the best place to do this i know. Dont have deadblow, which means i have to hold the carrier with one hand, piece of wood in the other, and a hammer with.....? It can be done i know but you see where im going.
I think what i may try is this
1. hook a ratchet strap to carrier
2. loosen cap bolts
3. alternately loosen bolts and tighten strap.
4. get lucky as hell and pull ring gear far enough to disengage the pinion.
Obviously, i’ve never pulled a carrier so i’m just talkin out of my rear.

 

[19Walt93]

I wouldn't do that. If you're just replacing the pinion seal you can rotate the pinion back and forth within the backlash and feel the preload by hand. If there's no drag it's too loose, you should feel some resistance. If you pull the carrier out you're making a lot of work for yourself, and the carrier bearings are under preload, too, so reinserting the shims can be tough. Some ring and pinion sets are non-hunting, meaning they have to mesh together one way to avoid noise. There would be a paint mark on 2 ring gear teeth and one pinion tooth.

 

[ericbphoto]

Some ring and pinion sets are non-hunting, meaning they have to mesh together one way to avoid noise. There would be a paint mark on 2 ring gear teeth and one pinion tooth.

Never heard that before. Thank you.

 

[sgtsandman]

Some ring and pinion sets are non-hunting, meaning they have to mesh together one way to avoid noise. There would be a paint mark on 2 ring gear teeth and one pinion tooth.

That one is a new one to me as well.

 

[19Walt93]

The 3.55 geared 8 inch in my Mustang is non hunting.

 

[sickwilly]

I wouldn't do that. If you're just replacing the pinion seal you can rotate the pinion back and forth within the backlash and feel the preload by hand. If there's no drag it's too loose, you should feel some resistance. If you pull the carrier out you're making a lot of work for yourself, and the carrier bearings are under preload, too, so reinserting the shims can be tough. Some ring and pinion sets are non-hunting, meaning they have to mesh together one way to avoid noise. There would be a paint mark on 2 ring gear teeth and one pinion tooth.

To clarify, my reason for even contemplating taking the carrier out is that after replacing the seal , i have a whine on acceleration that wasnt there before. I didn’t touch anything else (put nut back in same place) so I couldn’t see where i could have affected anything but the preload. That’s why i wanted to double check preload with actual dial type torque wrench, in which case -gotta remove the carrier for that.
BUT, thats why i asked. Im not sure how deep i want/should go down this rabbit hole.
What i can say is the flange has no play other than backlash and its not hard to turn. It feels close to what it was before i did anything, maybe a touch less drag if anything.
I was just trying to get it as right as possible before i call it done and im not sure how much i should worry about the noise on acceleration. I don’t want to tear up more than i fix.
Now, if anybody has a general range as to what preload should be WITH carrier, that would be great. But im guessing it doesn't work that way.
Thanks for the replies.

 

[sickwilly]

Just out of curiosity, gears are original factory as far as hunting/non hunting. Ive only seen one paint mark on outside edge of the ring gear bout big as your thumb.

 

[19Walt93]

If there's a paint mark on the ring gear there might be one on the end of the pinion, making them non hunting gears. If you picked up a whine after a new seal try just tightening the nut a hair more. Marking the nut is better than nothing but it's not close enough. A bearing with slightly too much preload will survive, a slightly loose bearing will not.

 

[4x4junkie]

I don't believe I've ever seen non-hunting gears for 7.5" and 8.8" axles, I think that may be an 8" and 9" thing.


I've never tried pulling a carrier out just far enough to try to disengage the pinion... I suspect by the time the gear teeth clear each other, the carrier will already be falling out of the housing. But maybe I'm wrong.
This might be something you'll have to see for yourself.

 

[sickwilly]

If there's a paint mark on the ring gear there might be one on the end of the pinion, making them non hunting gears. If you picked up a whine after a new seal try just tightening the nut a hair more. Marking the nut is better than nothing but it's not close enough. A bearing with slightly too much preload will survive, a slightly loose bearing will not.

Ok thanks, i’ll tighten it 1/12 a turn and see how pinion drag feels. Actually would’ve done it already but everything i read says whine on Deceleration is too little preload while my noise is on acceleration and i didn’t want to make it worse. But I also know what you read on the internet aint always what what happens in reality.

 

[sickwilly]

I don't believe I've ever seen non-hunting gears for 7.5" and 8.8" axles, I think that may be an 8" and 9" thing.


I've never tried pulling a carrier out just far enough to try to disengage the pinion... I suspect by the time the gear teeth clear each other, the carrier will already be falling out of the housing. But maybe I'm wrong.
This might be something you'll have to see for yourself.

It was just a thought, may not even make sense. The bearings may well fall out by the time it gets far enough. Would be a nice trick IF it worked though.

 

[4x4junkie]

No, it fully made sense. I'm just not sure that because of the angle at which the teeth mesh, that they would clear before the carrier bearings are already out of the housing.

As for tightening it, I'd suggest go in very small steps, like 1/20 of a turn. The preload comes up VERY fast once the bearings are in contact with the races, and if you end up going too far, then everything will have to come apart to replace the crush sleeve.

 

[franklin2]

In my experience, the sleeve is very difficult to collpase any further. The preload and crush were set when the rearend was put together. I don't think you have to worry about it being too tight, the crush sleeve will prevent that unless you really bear down on it with a impact.