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Hydrogen powered Ranger


Dirt Squirt

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I guess once we get the infrastructure in place, and can figure out a better battery/ storage system made in the USA, and home chargers that don't burn down your home, the technology may be ok. Not for me though.
 


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RonD

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Yup, that's what humans do, figure things out, "necessity is the Mother of invention"

And humans also have a healthy resistance to change, so new ideas take awhile to be adopted by the majority, "we" like a "track record", lol

"Lets get Mikey to try it"

Although newer generations are more used to faster changes because that's what they grew up with
And they have FOMO(fear of missing out) as a social pressure :)
 

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I read an article about the affect of temperature on EV range, going from 70f to 40f the range was reduced by 24%. How long will the battery last at -20 with the electric heater, electric lights, electric windshield wipers, and electric rear defroster all using power?
 

RonD

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I read an article about the affect of temperature on EV range, going from 70f to 40f the range was reduced by 24%. How long will the battery last at -20 with the electric heater, electric lights, electric windshield wipers, and electric rear defroster all using power?
You forgot about battery heaters
But range really drops in the Cold

Maybe.............that's who started the whole Global Warming thing....................people invested in electric cars, if it ain't cold.........$$$$$
I smell a conspiracy.......................................theory
 

1990RangerinSK

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While its true if you charge your EV in an area that uses coal, your car is essentially coal powered. But, we are discussing energy conservation, i.e how much energy does it take overall to get the wheels of your vehicle spinning. You never ever ever get more energy out of a system than you put into it, it's always less because energy is wasted. On a gasoline engine about 80% of the energy from the fuel is wasted creating heat, only about 20% actually goes into turning the wheels on a good day. Hydrogen is something like 95+% wasted and the production process uses WAY more energy than refining gasoline. With an EV a higher percentage of that potential energy stored in the batteries can be directly converted into turning the wheels so EV's are more efficient overall. Total energy losses in an EV from start to finish is less than gasoline even factoring in the power plant that's charging the batteries. EV technology is only now becoming a true viable option though because we had no idea how to store enough electricity. Battery technology sucked until the past couple decades, now that we are starting to see batteries that can store more energy we are seeing EV that can travel 400 miles and charge in 30 minutes instead of 20 years ago where you could travel 60 miles and charge in 12 hours...
Except that they can't travel 400 miles. 250 miles is more like it. Now, here's the thing: The nearest city to me is 90 miles away. I want to go to the city tomorrow, driving my electric car. Because it's so far away, I've planned a number of stops in the city, involving driving about 60 miles around the city. 90 miles into the city. 60 miles driving around the city running errands. 90 miles home. 240 miles. My car dies 10 miles from my driveway.

So, I take half an hour to charge my car while I'm in the city. Total drive time to and from the city, three hours. Drive time around the city, two hours. Charge time, 30 minutes. I increase travel time by 10% to charge my car.

Compare that to a comparably sized car with an ICE. I'll use my Honda Fit. It routinely got 40 miles per gallon on the highway, and 28 in the city. So, I fill up the 10 gallon tank before I leave home. Drive to the city, I've used 2 gallons of fuel. Drive around the city, I've used another 3 gallons of fuel. Drive home, I use another two gallons, for a total of 10 gallons of fuel. I'm on fumes when I park the car, so when I arrive in my town, I stop at the gas station and fill the tank, taking five minutes.

I'm entirely in favour of electric cars. But, I won't buy one until I can drive to the city, drive around the city, and drive home without charging.
 

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You need a New Maverick (y)

Hybrid NO plug in
 

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Except that they can't travel 400 miles. 250 miles is more like it. Now, here's the thing: The nearest city to me is 90 miles away. I want to go to the city tomorrow, driving my electric car. Because it's so far away, I've planned a number of stops in the city, involving driving about 60 miles around the city. 90 miles into the city. 60 miles driving around the city running errands. 90 miles home. 240 miles. My car dies 10 miles from my driveway.

So, I take half an hour to charge my car while I'm in the city. Total drive time to and from the city, three hours. Drive time around the city, two hours. Charge time, 30 minutes. I increase travel time by 10% to charge my car.

Compare that to a comparably sized car with an ICE. I'll use my Honda Fit. It routinely got 40 miles per gallon on the highway, and 28 in the city. So, I fill up the 10 gallon tank before I leave home. Drive to the city, I've used 2 gallons of fuel. Drive around the city, I've used another 3 gallons of fuel. Drive home, I use another two gallons, for a total of 10 gallons of fuel. I'm on fumes when I park the car, so when I arrive in my town, I stop at the gas station and fill the tank, taking five minutes.

I'm entirely in favour of electric cars. But, I won't buy one until I can drive to the city, drive around the city, and drive home without charging.
Tesla Model S range is 412 miles, Lucid AE is 520 miles. Many EVs have ranges over 300 miles, even the mustang Mach E is rated at 305. So here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.

DIhKfJpXkAESgoa.jpg
 
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Tesla Model S range is 412 miles, Lucid AE is 520 miles. Many EVs have ranges over 300 miles, even the mustang Mach E is rated at 305. So here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.

View attachment 65787
I think what he was getting at is that for a rural person or someone who lives considerable distance away from the amenities and shopping, the battery range is cutting it close. the numbers you mention are for good weather and conditions. even your 520 mile range EV will drastically be reduced in a below freezing or above 110 degree desert environment. plus all of the added electronics to make that rip safe and comfortable will further reduce the battery life. Also this is with a brand new battery pack. as the car and battery age, that range is going down..

For a person in 1990SK's demographic, available public charging stations where you can leave the car charge for 30 minutes would greatly help, especially if you are doing shopping anyways. but unless it is a major metropolitan area, most cities do not have that kind of infrastructure yet. Here in Indianapolis, there are a limited amount of public charging stations but I would not want to bet my ability to get home on finding one readily available near where I am shopping...

And as for the bunny... now where did I put my stew pot...

AJ
 

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Most electricity isn't generated from coal or fossil fuel at this point. And there's a significant difference in efficiency between generating it at large plants rather than tens of thousands of small ICE's.
We still don't have a super awesome way to generate electricity though.

The windmills are ugly, kill lots of birds of prey and tie up vast amounts of land. Plus when they wear out they can't be disposed of yet so they are buried.. While on my way back from Indiana and driving past them I got to wondering if they figured the upkeep of a road running to each and every one of them into their report cards... that is a heck of a lot of gravel. And I assume they would have to clear snow in the winter. I am surrounded by red lights on windmills blinking in unison at night in the distance... very nice

Solor is more passive but still ugly, large land footprint (unless private stuff on roofs) and expensive. I have mulled putting panels on my barn roof but $$ takes the fun out of it.

Dams screw up the ecology of the river and are operated by man also in the name of tourism which can REALLY screw things up (see the flooding on the Missouri a few years ago)

 

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yes, there is some range loss due to cold and running heater

but you can add 200 miles in 15 minutes with a Tesla Supercharger
If a supercharger isn't available, a level 2 charger will add 30 miles an hour. so find a place with destination charging and charge your car while you eat and shop. Alot of these places are starting to offer free charging while you shop
 

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Tesla Model S range is 412 miles, Lucid AE is 520 miles. Many EVs have ranges over 300 miles, even the mustang Mach E is rated at 305. So here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.

View attachment 65787
Are those miles flat rate or do city miles count different than highway? A/C effect it?

Having chargers around you could leave the car at would help but around here they are VERY spotty.

I did notice at least two new Tesla stations I don't remember being there on my trip to Indiana this past year (they were like in Illinois though)
 

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Nearly all EV's have higher mileage ratings in city driving than highway because of the regenerative braking systems.

Agreed that charging infrastructure has a long way to go. Though if you compare the current state to ten (or even five) years ago, it's improved immensely already. The grid itself is still a huge limiting factor too.
 

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Are those miles flat rate or do city miles count different than highway? A/C effect it?

Having chargers around you could leave the car at would help but around here they are VERY spotty.

I did notice at least two new Tesla stations I don't remember being there on my trip to Indiana this past year (they were like in Illinois though)
My experience is the Tesla keeps historical info on energy usage while driving. 250-300wh/mile is normal
It uses this info to determine total range.

Meaning that if you drive fast and hard alot, it will try to reflect that and show you less range than someone who drives lighter
 

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Are those miles flat rate or do city miles count different than highway? A/C effect it?

Having chargers around you could leave the car at would help but around here they are VERY spotty.

I did notice at least two new Tesla stations I don't remember being there on my trip to Indiana this past year (they were like in Illinois though)
Those are the EPA average numbers not Tesla's. The EPA tracks them the same they do with a gasoline engines fuel economy so I would expect them to be a somewhat conservative average. A light foot around town could probably get more, lead foot on the highway probably less. (EV's are backwards)
 

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Tesla Model S range is 412 miles, Lucid AE is 520 miles. Many EVs have ranges over 300 miles, even the mustang Mach E is rated at 305. So here's a bunny with a pancake on its head.

View attachment 65787
That's two pancakes. You might wanna get your eyes checked.

Those are all out of my price range. Nissan's Leaf is closer to my price range, as is Chevrolet's Bolt. Hose, however, have a range of about 200 miles. That doesn't get me home.
 


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