Going back in.... last time i hope..

[mc17eln]

The only way I can think of to help you is for you to tell me individual FORScan diagnostic items, so I can test and tell you my readings. Best candidates will be those stand-alone readings not effected by other components. Bad ones, such as if reading X < Y, there are 10 possibilities, won't help you. Let me know. I just got my ELM327 USB Tuesday and installed FORScan this morning for the first time.

 

[Orca]

Forgive me for saying this because I know that you're already very frustrated, but you're "all over the place" on diagnosing this vehicle. I'd really like to see you solve these issues, so I'll offer some "armchair quarterback" advice, in the hope that it starts to help, even if just a little.

First:

It showed readings for the injectors on LTFT but not STFT [...]

No better except I have com with my injectors.

These are the original Injectors. I took the others out cause I couldn't get readings off of them....

Assuming that "com" means "communication", please clarify exactly what "com with my injectors" means because I think you may be slightly confused. I have more to say, but I need to understand what you mean first.

Second: I don't see any evidence that you've confirmed that the fuel pressure is not excessive, per RonD's earlier advice. "Shot a stream of gas about 10' the size of a #2 pencil" is interesting, but not very definitive. A fuel pressure gauge on the fuel rail's Schrader valve is definitive.

Third: Ignore DTC P1000 for now. That just means "OBD Systems Readiness Test Not Complete" which translates to "owner disconnected the battery or did a PCM reset ('cleared codes') and vehicle hasn't been able to run all vehicle monitors". That might also explain why your (FORScan, I presume) Key-On, Engine-Off, On-Demand Self-Test failed, but I'm not positive. Frankly, I don't think there's cause (yet) to condemn (or even suspect) the PCM.

Fourth: Forget about "BARO". Too long to explain here/now.

Fifth: Earlier, you said "Fuel system has a CL fault." If this is happening regularly, it could be a problem. Have you been monitoring the "fuel system status" ("FUELSYS" PID in FORScan)? This can be very important in diagnosing. I presume that's where you saw "CL-Fault", but your descriptions are often too vague to be certain.

I may have more to say, but this post is long enough already, right?

 

[Shadowridr1]

Forgive me for saying this because I know that you're already very frustrated, but you're "all over the place" on diagnosing this vehicle. I'd really like to see you solve these issues, so I'll offer some "armchair quarterback" advice, in the hope that it starts to help, even if just a little.

First:

Assuming that "com" means "communication", please clarify exactly what "com with my injectors" means because I think you may be slightly confused. I have more to say, but I need to understand what you mean first.

Second: I don't see any evidence that you've confirmed that the fuel pressure is not excessive, per RonD's earlier advice. "Shot a stream of gas about 10' the size of a #2 pencil" is interesting, but not very definitive. A fuel pressure gauge on the fuel rail's Schrader valve is definitive.

Third: Ignore DTC P1000 for now. That just means "OBD Systems Readiness Test Not Complete" which translates to "owner disconnected the battery or did a PCM reset ('cleared codes') and vehicle hasn't been able to run all vehicle monitors". That might also explain why your (FORScan, I presume) Key-On, Engine-Off, On-Demand Self-Test failed, but I'm not positive. Frankly, I don't think there's cause (yet) to condemn (or even suspect) the PCM.

Fourth: Forget about "BARO". Too long to explain here/now.

Fifth: Earlier, you said "Fuel system has a CL fault." If this is happening regularly, it could be a problem. Have you been monitoring the "fuel system status" ("FUELSYS" PID in FORScan)? This can be very important in diagnosing. I presume that's where you saw "CL-Fault", but your descriptions are often too vague to be certain.

I may have more to say, but this post is long enough already, right?

First let me start by saying, I'm really not this dumb, but I've never tore into an engine with a pcm/ computer other than normal, regular maintenance. No injectors, only carbs, no synchronizer, only distributor, no coil pack, no O2 sensor so I'm learning that basically I'm dumb as shit when it comes to this ELECTRONICALLY CONTROLLED SYSTEM....I'm trying, but yes freaking out...

1. Yes,
com= communication, the new injectors were not giving me any readings on my obd2. Idk why, I put my old ones back in and instantly had readings.

2. No, sadly I have not.. there was 1 place in town with a fuel pressure test kit and it was $150. I have one on order that should be here Monday.

3. Not condemning the PCM is great. Cause I honestly want this truck right.

4. The baro is confusing, but from what I've read it goes off elevation to a .10 calculation and engine size yad-yad.

5. I've only just started using forscan. Yes that is where it went from closed loop to a closed loop fault was on fuel system status. I only noticed it that once, and I didn't pay attention to it this morning.

I'm heading to work. I can answer question but I won't be around the truck for the next day or so. Orca I appreciate your help. I appreciate everyone's help. I'm sorry I'm a bother

 

[pjtoledo]

as little as 60 seconds running will show elevated temps on the exhaust manifolds. get in close on the individual ports, next to the head.
that may have trouble showing rich cylinders, but it definitely reveals any dead ones.

 

[Shadowridr1]

as little as 60 seconds running will show elevated temps on the exhaust manifolds. get in close on the individual ports, next to the head.
that may have trouble showing rich cylinders, but it definitely reveals any dead ones.

PJ, I'll do that when I get back. I got tied up getting the downstream o2 sensor out and the new one in and with making certain my timing was SPOT ON.

 

[Orca]

No need to reply to this, since you'll be at work. I'll keep an eye on this thread for whenever you have something to add.

First let me start by saying, I'm really not this dumb, but I've never tore into an engine with a pcm/ computer other than normal, regular maintenance. No injectors, only carbs, no synchronizer, only distributor, no coil pack, no O2 sensor so I'm learning that basically I'm dumb as shit when it comes to this ELECTRONICALLY CONTROLLED SYSTEM....I'm trying, but yes freaking out...

FWIW, I don't think you're dumb. Quite the contrary. (1) You're asking questions on a forum full of smart, helpful people. (2) You've got a scantool and good software (FORScan and Torque Pro) to drive it. That makes you quite wise in my book. So hang in there just a bit longer. Don't freak out just yet!

1. Yes, com= communication, the new injectors were not giving me any readings on my obd2. Idk why, I put my old ones back in and instantly had readings.

Need a bit more info, please. What "readings" were you not getting with the new injectors versus the old ones? If you mean that some of the FORScan values ("PIDs", aka "Parameter IDs") were not appearing, then I'm curious as to which specific ones were problematic. And was this under FORScan, Torque Pro, or both? (I'm good with FORScan but don't use Torque Pro.)

To help you understand why I'm asking this, let me explain.... The only fuel-injector-related things on a Ford Ranger that I'm aware of which can be monitored are: (1) fuel injector faults and (2) per-bank, PCM-commanded fuel injector pulse widths (i.e. to see how long the PCM is telling each bank of injectors to open). The fuel injectors themselves do not really "communicate" with the PCM, at least in the sense that I think your earlier comments implied. The PCM commands them. That's why I'm intently curious about what "readings" work or don't work.

2. No, sadly I have not.. there was 1 place in town with a fuel pressure test kit and it was $150. I have one on order that should be here Monday.

Excellent.

4. The baro is confusing, but from what I've read it goes off elevation to a .10 calculation and engine size yad-yad.

The "BARO" (barometric pressure) PID will not typically be changing. If I recall correctly, it's updated only once per "trip" (probably at "key on", but I might be wrong about that) and anytime the vehicle is at Wide-Open Throttle (WOT). I scanned my old logs (over 3 years of data) from my 2004 Ranger and saw the "BARO" PID range from 27.75 - 29.75 inHg. So, in general, I don't think the "BARO" PID is going to be very useful here.

5. I've only just started using forscan. Yes that is where it went from closed loop to a closed loop fault was on fuel system status. I only noticed it that once, and I didn't pay attention to it this morning.

"CL-Fault" means that the vehicle is operating in "Closed loop, but fault with at least one oxygen sensor -- may be using single oxygen sensor for fuel control". Operating in closed-loop mode is good, of course, but there must've been something wrong with 1 or more of your (presumably, upstream) O2 sensors. If you only saw "CL-Fault" briefly, it's not too big a concern, IMHO. But I'd keep my eye on that FORScan "FUELSYS" PID if you can.

A couple of closing thoughts...

I'd forget about the CEL. You (wisely) have all the necessary tools to directly monitor DTCs (Diagnostic Trouble Codes), both "stored" and "pending". "Pending" DTCs typically don't light up the CEL, so you need to monitor for them with a scantool. Heck, even some "stored" DTCs don't light the CEL! Check for DTCs frequently when diagnosing! Very few people do this.

Furthermore, when a DTC is reported, you can then check what's called the "freeze frame" data to see the conditions (engine RPM, etc) under which the DTC triggered. Sometimes that helps, sometimes it doesn't, but the data will be there for you if you think to check it. Again, very few people do this. They quickly "reset codes" and (innocently but foolishly) blow away all "freeze frame" data. Don't be that guy.

I'm heading to work. I can answer question but I won't be around the truck for the next day or so. Orca I appreciate your help. I appreciate everyone's help. I'm sorry I'm a bother

As I said earlier, no rush. And you're not a bother at all. I just hope some of my advice proves useful, eventually.

 

[Shadowridr1]

1. So, the injector communication I'm referring to is the percentages for long-term, short-term and fuel trim. I'm not certain of the significance of there's any at all.
2.
3.
4. I mention Baro, because it's part of our MAF. I have only cleaned this and not replaced it. So I wonder at times if it's functioning properly. Cause I can unplug it and sometimes the engine rpm won't change and sometimes it will, so idk.

5. I can't comment anymore on the CL-fault thing. I will pay more attention to it when I get back. I just know it did it that 1 time.

IF there is anything specific I need to do I will. Like I already mentioned the forscan app is new to me and kinda tricky compared to the torque app, but I'm figuring it out. So, if you want something in general on the dashboard tell me which PID to use please

 

[Orca]

If it were me, I wouldn't be running that engine too much until I could verify the fuel pressure. That 'total misfires' counter ("MFTot" in the upper right corner for anyone following this) is increasing steadily in one of your Torque Pro videos and that's a bit worrisome, IMHO.

4. I mention Baro, because it's part of our MAF.

Are you sure? Typically, IIUC, a barometric pressure reading comes from a MAP (Manifold Absolute Pressure) sensor. But my 2004 Ranger does not report MAP via the usual SAE-standardized PID, even though some of my other (non-Ford) vehicles do. I don't think my Ranger has a MAP sensor. And I see no input pin on a PCM "pinout" diagram for a relevant sensor or related input. In fact, Ford's own documentation says that the "BARO" PID "may be software[-]determined", so I suspect that the value is computed somehow from other sensor data, but how? I really don't know and would love to find out!

Regardless, there's certainly no harm in occasionally monitoring the "BARO" PID with FORScan. Just don't expect it to be changing very often, per my previous post. And when you're monitoring something that does change very frequently, like O2 sensor voltages, each extra PID being monitored only slows down the overall update rate, so it's good to "shed" useless PIDs when possible and appropriate. As for MAF, you can monitor that directly, so if the MAF sensor is acting up, you should be able to see it by graphing the PID (more on that below).

1. So, the injector communication I'm referring to is the percentages for long-term, short-term and fuel trim. I'm not certain of the significance of there's any at all.

OK, I thought there was some confusion. Be aware that the STFT and LTFT values come from the PCM, not the injectors. The PCM, based on feedback from the O2 sensors when running "closed-loop", computes and uses those values to control the injectors, adjusting the pulse width to control how long the injectors are, well, "injecting". The injectors do not compute, store, or report STFT or LTFT. So I'm even more curious now why you stopped seeing values in FORScan or Torque Pro for those STFT and/or LTFT percentages with the new injectors! I've never seen that happen. What exactly, if you can recall, did FORScan or Torque Pro show for those PIDs? Just a blank display? I wonder if the PCM was reporting any fuel injector faults at that time? You should probably find and monitor those 6 "injector fault" PIDs (1 for each cylinder) at some point, regardless of whether you have old or new fuel injectors installed. (Torque Pro might be useful here because it allows multiple screens of groups of PIDs. That way you can easily select groups of PIDs that you're only occasionally interested in monitoring.)

Another thought crosses my mind, but I don't know if this is sensible. Maybe, at some point (not yet?), you could install just 1 of the new fuel injectors and then monitor the PIDs related to fuel injectors, especially the 6 "fault" PIDs, but also the Bank #1 and Bank #2 pulse widths. Also, since STFT and LTFT reports from the PCM are per-bank, if you stopped seeing 1 of them it would be interesting if it correlated to the cylinder/bank in which the new injector was installed. I'm not sure it's worth doing that just yet, if ever -- it's just "food for thought".

[...] the forscan app is new to me and kinda tricky compared to the torque app, but I'm figuring it out.

When I use FORScan, it's always on a laptop, under Windows. I've run the very limited FORScan Demo (for Android) but never FORScan Lite (for Android). FORScan for Windows has the most capabilities, but FORScan Lite (on Android) will probably be adequate for your immediate needs. For Ford (and Lincoln, Mercury, and Mazda), FORScan is better than Torque Pro because it typically already "knows" all the available PIDs (for all modules -- PCM, ABS, etc). But Torque Pro is clearly useful in many cases, so it's good to know both, IMHO.

Does FORScan Lite allow graphing of PIDs? It's called "Oscilloscope" on FORScan for Windows. Graphing a PID's response is virtually indispensable in some cases (like when monitoring STFT on upstream O2 sensors) because a single display (even in a video showing the changes in value) just isn't adequate to discern how the PID is really behaving.

 

[mc17eln]

@Shadowridr1 Okay, I ran FORScan and collected 3+ idle minutes of fuel trim and O2 voltage readings. Let me know. Full disclosure, I plan to do the post-rebuild smog check this afternoon

 

[Shadowridr1]

So, I got home at 5am this morning and I was curious about the injectors I bought. I did a pretty deep search but finally came to some conclusions that makes some sense. Even though I gave the seller full detail on my engine INCLUDING my partial vin to indicate what injectors I needed, they still sent me FLEX FUEL injectors. So, I'm kinda stuck for a little bit even though I DO have my old injectors in, they are no good. 1 reads 10ohms, 2 others are 11.8 ohms and the other 3 are 12.4 ohms. PLUS I have an injector connector that the clip it broke on, so I'm just going to order another new set of injectors AND new injector pigtails as well. By then my fuel pressure tester should be here and I'll just get it all done at once.

 

[Orca]

I don't think I've seen it mentioned yet... What is the engine size? (I suggest adding that to the vehicle information in your user profile.)

[...] even though I DO have my old injectors in, they are no good. 1 reads 10ohms, 2 others are 11.8 ohms and the other 3 are 12.4 ohms.

Just curious... What are you basing that "no good" assessment on? With 1 possible exception (the 10-ohm one), the resistance of your old injectors looks OK to me, based solely on one source I looked at just now which says this for a 2003 Mazda B3000: "between 11.0-18.0 ohms for 4.0L or 8.5-15.5 ohms for 3.0L or 11.0-13.0 ohms for 2.3L".

I implore you, if you haven't already, to check again (and frequently thereafter) for DTCs (Diagnostic Trouble Codes). Especially pending DTCs. A lot of the troubleshooting charts for these vehicles depend on knowing which DTCs are being reported. I know you're getting DTC P1000, but we know to ignore that one for now. You also mentioned P0505 ("Idle Air Control System") at one point. Is that DTC still being reported? Any others?

I think you're on the right path to solving this. Still keeping my fingers crossed.

In the spirit of what @mc17eln offered, I can also give you some typical readings for various things, like O2 sensor voltages, injector pulse widths, MAF (etc), from my 2004 4.0L Ranger, if it will help at some point.

@mc17eln: Just curious... Did you pass the smog check?

 

[Shadowridr1]

I don't think I've seen it mentioned yet... What is the engine size? (I suggest adding that to the vehicle information in your user profile.)Just curious... What are you basing that "no good" assessment on? With 1 possible exception (the 10-ohm one), the resistance of your old injectors looks OK to me, based solely on one source I looked at just now which says this for a 2003 Mazda B3000: "between 11.0-18.0 ohms for 4.0L or 8.5-15.5 ohms for 3.0L or 11.0-13.0 ohms for 2.3L".

I implore you, if you haven't already, to check again (and frequently thereafter) for DTCs (Diagnostic Trouble Codes). Especially pending DTCs. A lot of the troubleshooting charts for these vehicles depend on knowing which DTCs are being reported. I know you're getting DTC P1000, but we know to ignore that one for now. You also mentioned P0505 ("Idle Air Control System") at one point. Is that DTC still being reported? Any others?

I updated my profile. I've been meaning to anyway.... yes it's a 3.0. Orca my injectors are bad. 1 has a crack down the side, it's not leaking there but still scary. They are OEM with 116k miles on them, and with none of the ohm readings being close to consistent with each other, plus with the fact that I was tearing into the engine anyway, I opted to just replace them. I can't say definitively that any are leaking, but when I first removed them 3 were hellanasty on the top side. I only assumed they were clogged or bad. I can also attest that after I put the engine back together, before the new injectors came in, the truck started on me 3 different times attempting the clear flood mode. Key indication of leaking injectors. When I put the new injectors in, it did it as well. However, like I mentioned above I was sent injectors FLEX FUEL... with a flow rate of 21.6 lb/hr. My oem injectors are rated at 14. I gave the seller all the info including my vin to the 8th digit. No reason for them to have screwed this up. The plug connection was freakishly tight and when I removed them to put my old injectors back in I broke 3 clips on my injector plugs. Of course it's the 3 under the plenum..... they still hold down but need to be replaced now.
The p0505 is still there when I stopped messing with the truck a few days ago. I put the old IAC back on to see if that made a difference and it didn't. I have not done anything to the pickup since I got home yesterday, but I will, if you have suggestions on something I need to try. Otherwise I was going to pull the instrument cluster and swap over to the white face gauge, and change the oil again cause it's very thin and smells like gas. Hell everything smells like gas and the pickup hasn't been started or messed with in 3 days. Also the damn fuel pressure tester has been delayed . Thinking of going and buy one now that the autozone close to me has one in store and just returning the other when it comes in.

 

[Orca]

Orca my injectors are bad. 1 has a crack down the side, it's not leaking there but still scary. They are OEM with 116k miles on them, and with none of the ohm readings being close to consistent with each other, [...]

Don't get me wrong... I wasn't 2nd-guessing your purchase of new injectors. I just wanted to make sure that you weren't condemning the originals based solely on the measured resistance. Forgive me if I misread and/or mis-understood.

Bummer about the delay in delivery of FP gauge, but maybe when the new, proper injectors are finally installed, you won't need it???

 

[Shadowridr1]

Don't get me wrong... I wasn't 2nd-guessing your purchase of new injectors. I just wanted to make sure that you weren't condemning the originals based solely on the measured resistance. Forgive me if I misread and/or mis-understood.

Bummer about the delay in delivery of FP gauge, but maybe when the new, proper injectors are finally installed, you won't need it???

No, sir. Wasn't taken that way at all, Honestly. When I purchased this truck I was completely in shock at how well the previous owner took care of it....I should have really dug in deep and looked at crap like this. I don't think he did much in PREVENTIVE MAINTENANCE as far as the engine was concerned.... that's my fault and now I'm eating crow. Good part is that if I can get this thing back going there only a couple things that could go wrong or mess up I guess. If the water pump starts leaking I'll replace the timing chain then or visa-versa. If the rings start to fail I can buy a short block and transfer everyone over or have this block machined and bored. I mean in all honesty by the time it's said and done I probably could have found a 5.0 and done a swap for the same amount of money, which is sickening to think about, lol

 

[mc17eln]

@mc17eln: Just curious... Did you pass the smog check?

Yes I did. Thanks for asking @Orca . I notice my test report has no readings, just PASS or N/A. I asked the guy why he didn't use that probe at the tail pipe, he said, "I could". May be the rules have changed. Overall, my truck has no odd smell in the engine bay or the exhaust, no oil and coolant leak. Its idle has a very small and periodic jitter, which will be my future FORScan homework.