Engineers: Old vs new engine tech

[85_Ranger4x4]

If you like the sound a tractor makes, sure.

I'm of the opinion that a high hp/low cube motor sounds infinitely more interesting than a low hp/big cube motor.

I'd much rather listen to an f1 car than the burble of a 150hp 454.

Lots of other factors come in to play with exhaust note though...

Headers sound better than manifolds. Higher compression sounds better than lower compression. A flat plane crank sounds way wilder than a cross plane crank could ever dream of. True duals vs x-pipe vs h-pipe. Length of exhaust. How many bends the exhaust has.. a boggling amount of factors really.

They did put Detroits in tractors...

No low end, hit a tough spot and if you don't start grabbing gears they do a very loud and leaky face plant.

 

[Chapap]

I'd much rather listen to an f1 car than the burble of a 150hp 454.

I’d love to have one of those v12 Mercedes for the sole purpose of the sound.

 

[Blmpkn]

They did put Detroits in tractors...

No low end, hit a tough spot and if you don't start grabbing gears they do a very loud and leaky face plant.

Two stroke diesels sound like love for sure. Especially strung out.

I’d love to have one of those v12 Mercedes for the sole purpose of the sound.

It would make a fantastic alarm clock!

So would a Rowdy multi rotor wankel.

 

[ericbphoto]

What "sounds good" is purely personal opinion and has little or nothing to do with the Hp vs torque discussion.

 

[Chapap]

What "sounds good" is purely personal opinion and has little or nothing to do with the Hp vs torque discussion.

Do high volume, low power engines sound different, or is that just bias on my part? More burbley, grumbly?

 

[rusty ol ranger]

Do high volume, low power engines sound different, or is that just bias on my part? More burbley, grumbly?

I believe the sound has much more to do with the number of cylinders, exhaust port, manifold/header and pipe shapeing then power of the engine.

 

[Blmpkn]

Do high volume, low power engines sound different, or is that just bias on my part? More burbley, grumbly?

Increasing the amount of explosion within a certain volume absolutely changes the sound it creates.

Compare any fuel crisis Era v8 to the "same" v8 nowadays.. the fuel crisis motor is going to have a much lower tone and be super burbley compared to the new motor which will have a higher pitch and be... blatty? I guess lol. Hard to describe motor noises through text.

 

[rusty ol ranger]

Modern engines sound more computer synthisized then mechanical. Listen to a coyote with flowmasters vs a carbed 302

 

[Blmpkn]

A good in person comparison to how hp relates to noise would be to go to the local drag strip and stand next to a big block gas fired car doing a burnout... and then stand next to a big block alcohol car doing a burnout.

Potentially the same motor... but the alcohol car is going to be making WAY more power... the gas car will be loud and all... but the alcohol motor while heating the tires is going to rattle the soul loose from your body lol.

 

[ericbphoto]

Do high volume, low power engines sound different, or is that just bias on my part? More burbley, grumbly?

Sure, they sound different. But what sounds "good" to you may be entirely different from what sounds good to others.

The sound can be changed by many factors. Not all of those factors have anything to do with what gives the engine high power or torque at various rpms. And the sound is not what determines the Hp or torque. It is a byproduct.

 

[bobbywalter]

Low end torque is what matters most when loaded heavy.

My pete makes 475hp. But 1,850ftlb@1200 rpm. There are gas engines making that hp, but no where near the torque....so why dont peterbilt end their cummins contract and just put in a EB?

Im sorry dude but HP does very little untill youre already at 65 withe the cruise set, and even then torque is important.

Well ... My qsx makes 2800 ft lbs at 1600. ..and 675 hp at 2100 and it is slower then smoke off shit ....on big hills she bogs down to a crawl ... But the rig is 120k.... On flats it can do 70 plus.... Which is plenty.


So .... If we were racing the same style ranger..2900 pounds total weight with driver..what wins.???
Gasoline engines..


600 ft lbs...450 hp? 460....

450 ft lbs 600 hp.??? Stroker small block.??












You really don't get it do ya.?.?.?.?

You just really do not have a fucking clue how endothermic reactions are crafted ...

410 ft lb 460 was only a select setup at that . Took that long to get a truck over 400 ft lbs of torque....think long on that one....now 500 with half the motor is a real thing.

What good is that 460 in a primary commuter truck? Like most rangers and the f150.

There is a reason an 3.5 Ecoboost is not in a f250. Same reason I don't have one under the hood of my truck.....why a 118 whp POS diesel lives in there....



But you know .

it is the in a GT...and in the raptor.

Because a 460 all the time is a 460 all the time. Turbocharging it would only make it more useless for something you actually want to use, to do real world stuff....

especially towing....

gallons per mile would not sell to the need torque to tow for a living crowd.



And it's fuggin hungry. 460 gots to eat...

I feed a 7.3 right now....it's a modern 460. All of the techno gee gaw in this environment is just passable.

It's a perfect example to the op.

 

[bobbywalter]

I would say its the advancement of engine components and engine management (tuning), which allowed for the advancement of forced induction (blowers and turbos). Modern engines usually have more valves, cams, compression etc....and no pushrods or lifters etc to deal with... which allows for more power without compromising reliability/ driveability. Parts are made of better materials to tighter tolerances. Racers still use pushrod V8 blocks of their respective manufacturer, it just made of more modern materials and components. Also fuel injection and tuning allows for way more combustion control.

1000hp these days is like 500hp 20 years ago. Your average 1000hp engine is pretty much a V8 blown to hell, with components and tuning that can handle, and make good use of, all that boost.

Watching the street racing shows its amazing what they do with tuning. The 1000+ engine can be tuned for a 400hp launch, then variate the power throughout the rpm range based on track conditions. They tune it to what they think will make the tires stick the whole time, and usually the better tune wins the race.

Having said that, I could answer your question in two words: Pro Charger.

Is the current LS and hemi platform modern?

The Ford cammer v8 they beat themselves to death with ... All these years....

Compared to the LS and HEMI.....

Is a tough argument. Merit for sure.

Then gm put a cammer out.

And the argument is impossible.




That said.

I have a specific combination I can use....well that we use. It takes an old a block 302 or modern version of that block and makes 700 N/A hp and just under 600 ft lbs at the crank.

1 carb...still dizzy.

15 plus thousand in parts.

Will not make it to 50 k miles

 

[1990RangerinSK]

My '91 3.0 had a Flowmaster exhaust on it.

Leaving my grandparents' cabin (in a fairly deep valley, with a long, steep hill to get out), I'd cross the bottom of the valley in 4th at 30mph. About 1/4 mile from the bottom of the hill, dump into second and floor it, hit third at 45mph, then hold third all the way up the hill. I kinda liked how that sounded (could probably hear me dump it into second all the way over at my grandparents' place!), but I don't think I'd intentionally install a loud exhaust on a vehicle.

 

[bobbywalter]

Increasing the amount of explosion within a certain volume absolutely changes the sound it creates.

Compare any fuel crisis Era v8 to the "same" v8 nowadays.. the fuel crisis motor is going to have a much lower tone and be super burbley compared to the new motor which will have a higher pitch and be... blatty? I guess lol. Hard to describe motor noises through text.

You know....I was at the tiki hut....and a wet t shirt contest popped up back in 06 during Mardi gras in New Orleans... The hottest chick there turned out to be a dude.

A fawking dude!!! That shit really changed my perspective....because I was sober. That place is wild.



I say this ... Because at many automotive events over the last 25 years that I have attended, sometimes they have contraptions that sample like 5 to 10 systems on the same engines.

And, you will feel like I did at the tiki hut.


Shit ain't always what you think you remember it to be...

 

[sgtsandman]

A V6 sounds decent at idle and definitely better than a I4 at any RPM. A V8 sounds better than a V6 at any RPM. That's if you care about the exhaust note. I care more about if the engine gets the job I need it to do done. Exhaust note is just a bonus.