• Welcome Visitor! Please take a few seconds and Register for our forum. Even if you don't want to post, you can still 'Like' and react to posts.

4WD qusetion. because i dont know.


Ranger850

Doesn't get Sarcasm . . .
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Jan 24, 2018
Messages
8,426
Reaction score
4,664
Points
113
Location
Tallahassee Florida
Vehicle Year
2001
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
Born with a 3.0, looking for a donor V8
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Lift
Stock 2"
Tire Size
Stock
My credo
Doing things wrong, until I get it right.
Not that I'll ever own or drive a true 4x4 truck, I was wondering about the front end gears. I noticed rear end gears are always specified, (i.e. 3:7.3 & 4:1.0) but what about the front wheel drive gears on a 4WD. Are they the same ratio as the rears? essentially rear ends with steering capabilities. If that's the case, could you put a front end of a 4wd on the rears and someway have 4 wheel steering. Just a rambling thought in my head.:icon_confused:
 


JamesH

New Member
Joined
Apr 21, 2017
Messages
50
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Age
36
You have about 80% right. Front and rear are geared the same. (baring custom purpose builds where the front might be slightly higher ratio). The front gear set is Revere cut usually, because it will pull not push, some axles can have the same center houses, and different tubes/ends, so you could put regular cut gears in it and make it a rear steer.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
 

adsm08

Senior Master Grease Monkey
Supporting Member
Article Contributor
Ford Technician
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Sep 20, 2009
Messages
34,623
Reaction score
3,613
Points
113
Location
Dillsburg PA
Vehicle Year
1987
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Tire Size
31X10.50X15
A now inactive member here, Gwaii, did exactly that with an Explorer. It involved taking two of them and putting the front portion of one frame on the rear of the other.

Basically the skills needed are far more than the average person is likely to ever achieve.
 

pjtoledo

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2007
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
2,913
Points
113
Location
Toledo Ohio
Vehicle Year
20002005199
Make / Model
Fords
Engine Size
3.0 2.3
G M had some rear/all wheel steer trucks a few years ago.

there are lots of specialized all wheel steering vehicles in agriculture and industry and the monster trucks.

another point to ponder, for lane changing you want all 4 wheels to turn the same way.
for going around a corner the fronts will turn opposite of the rears.

that brings up an engineering challenge, how do you change lanes while turning a corner? :icon_confused:
 

Ranger850

Doesn't get Sarcasm . . .
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Jan 24, 2018
Messages
8,426
Reaction score
4,664
Points
113
Location
Tallahassee Florida
Vehicle Year
2001
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
Born with a 3.0, looking for a donor V8
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Lift
Stock 2"
Tire Size
Stock
My credo
Doing things wrong, until I get it right.
I remember a Honda prelude in the 90's had four wheel steering " for quicker lane changes". My buddy had one, it was a fast car but rws was barely noticeable. I think it was just a few degrees, not like full steering. The one in the GMC's didn't last very long either. That lane changing around a corner question is for an engineer to figure out. I guess you would have to pick, cornering or lane changes. lol
 

rusty ol ranger

Im a Jeep guy now.
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2007
Messages
12,267
Reaction score
7,275
Points
113
Location
Michigan
Vehicle Year
1987
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
2.9 V6
Engine Size
177 CID
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
My credo
A legend to the old man, a hero to the child...
IIRC the big selling point on the GMs were backing up trailers.

Not sure how in the many years before, and after that quadrasteer BS, anyone has managed to back up a trailer.

Or in dodges case, SEE the trailer.

To answer the OP, yes, front and rear axles need to be geared the same, unless the axles spend most of their time spinning (as in mud), youll tear shit up in a hurry if you run different ratios on anything remotly hard packed.

Also, running different size tires on the front and rear of a 4x4 is a bad idea, unless the gears have been swapped to compensate.
 

Ranger850

Doesn't get Sarcasm . . .
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Jan 24, 2018
Messages
8,426
Reaction score
4,664
Points
113
Location
Tallahassee Florida
Vehicle Year
2001
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
Born with a 3.0, looking for a donor V8
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Lift
Stock 2"
Tire Size
Stock
My credo
Doing things wrong, until I get it right.
IIRC the big selling point on the GMs were backing up trailers.

Not sure how in the many years before, and after that quadrasteer BS, anyone has managed to back up a trailer.

Or in dodges case, SEE the trailer.

To answer the OP, yes, front and rear axles need to be geared the same, unless the axles spend most of their time spinning (as in mud), youll tear shit up in a hurry if you run different ratios on anything remotly hard packed.

Also, running different size tires on the front and rear of a 4x4 is a bad idea, unless the gears have been swapped to compensate.
Ford 1up'ed GM with the "little backup button" that supposedly does all the work for you. Hasa anyone ever seen one of these in action. I'm curious as to how much better it is than sticking your head out the window and looking backwards.
 

rusty ol ranger

Im a Jeep guy now.
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2007
Messages
12,267
Reaction score
7,275
Points
113
Location
Michigan
Vehicle Year
1987
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
2.9 V6
Engine Size
177 CID
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
My credo
A legend to the old man, a hero to the child...
Ford 1up'ed GM with the "little backup button" that supposedly does all the work for you. Hasa anyone ever seen one of these in action. I'm curious as to how much better it is than sticking your head out the window and looking backwards.

Id like to see that thing wedge my 32ft travel trailer in my 12ft wide driveway off a 2 lane in town street...
 

RonD

Official TRS AI
TRS Technical Advisor
Joined
Jun 2, 2012
Messages
25,292
Reaction score
8,298
Points
113
Location
canada
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Transmission
Manual
Front differential is offset to one side to clear the engine, and it is OPEN on most 4x4s not Limited Slip, yes you can change that but why start off with it, lol.

Ford does have 8.8" Independent rear suspension(IRS), using CV joints which gets you a bit of turning ability, weld on brackets to hold differential
2002 and up Explorer/Mountaineer's had them, if from a 4x4 then it should be limited slip

Adding the stock upper and lower A-frames(reversed sides) to the rear shouldn't be too tough, but I am not the one doing it :)
I think the rear of the frame at the axle is 2" wider than front, so you may have to cut upper A-frame and shorten it, lower can just go in farther toward the middle

You could use the stock torsion bars, running forward, as suspension, not sure there would be enough room for a strut setup in wheel well.
You would need custom axles most likely, to match length and splines between Ranger hub and IRS differential.
But it is an 8.8" differential so there might be matchups
 
Last edited:

pjtoledo

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
U.S. Military - Veteran
Joined
Oct 5, 2007
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
2,913
Points
113
Location
Toledo Ohio
Vehicle Year
20002005199
Make / Model
Fords
Engine Size
3.0 2.3
the GM trucks used a conventional front straight axle with the differential relocated to fit/work in the rear steer setup. the axles were wider to push the wheels out farther to clear the leaf springs when turned. easy to spot from the rear because the knuckle mounts are exposed.

they are fantastic at parallel parking. the TV commercial showed a cute chickee wedging her truck in between 2 big bad bikers. :icon_thumby:


P. S.
are we still allowed to say "chickee"?
 

Denisefwd93

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2015
Messages
2,261
Reaction score
74
Points
48
Location
South East PA
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Total Lift
stock, may get leveling springs in front "somday"
Tire Size
235

rusty ol ranger

Im a Jeep guy now.
Supporting Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2007
Messages
12,267
Reaction score
7,275
Points
113
Location
Michigan
Vehicle Year
1987
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
2.9 V6
Engine Size
177 CID
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
My credo
A legend to the old man, a hero to the child...
the GM trucks used a conventional front straight axle with the differential relocated to fit/work in the rear steer setup. the axles were wider to push the wheels out farther to clear the leaf springs when turned. easy to spot from the rear because the knuckle mounts are exposed.

they are fantastic at parallel parking. the TV commercial showed a cute chickee wedging her truck in between 2 big bad bikers. :icon_thumby:


P. S.
are we still allowed to say "chickee"?
I always spot them by the half ass looking flareside box :icon_thumby:
 

Ranger850

Doesn't get Sarcasm . . .
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Jan 24, 2018
Messages
8,426
Reaction score
4,664
Points
113
Location
Tallahassee Florida
Vehicle Year
2001
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
Born with a 3.0, looking for a donor V8
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Lift
Stock 2"
Tire Size
Stock
My credo
Doing things wrong, until I get it right.
are we still allowed to say "chickee"?[/QUOTE]

Did we ever say " Chickee" to begin with? lol
 

Ranger850

Doesn't get Sarcasm . . .
TRS 20th Anniversary
Joined
Jan 24, 2018
Messages
8,426
Reaction score
4,664
Points
113
Location
Tallahassee Florida
Vehicle Year
2001
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Size
Born with a 3.0, looking for a donor V8
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
2WD
Total Lift
Stock 2"
Tire Size
Stock
My credo
Doing things wrong, until I get it right.

Denisefwd93

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 20, 2015
Messages
2,261
Reaction score
74
Points
48
Location
South East PA
Vehicle Year
1994
Make / Model
Ford
Engine Type
4.0 V6
Engine Size
4.0
Transmission
Manual
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Total Lift
stock, may get leveling springs in front "somday"
Tire Size
235
Because the thread drifted into rear wheel steering and I thought this was rather appropriate in childish way, sometimes I wonder how humor escapes so many people,
why is this pic in this thread?
 

Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Staff online

Members online

Today's birthdays

Member & Vendor Upgrades

For a small yearly donation, you can support this forum and receive a 'Supporting Member' banner, or become a 'Supporting Vendor' and promote your products here. Click the banner to find out how.

Latest posts

Truck of The Month


Kirby N.
March Truck of The Month

Recently Featured

Want to see your truck here? Share your photos and details in the forum.

Follow TRS On Instagram

TRS Events

25th Anniversary Sponsors

Check Out The TRS Store


Sponsored Ad


Sponsored Ad

Sponsored Ad


Amazon Deals

Top