2.9 ECM and Cam...need info

[19Walt93]

As a mechanic for 15 yrs professionally, what I need to know isn't solved by flashing the MIL/CEL for a code number, which isn't there as it hasn't had enough warm up cycles to set any hard codes (tech speak for codes that have happened on more than one drive cycle and have gone from the industry standard "pending" to the industry standard "stored") What I need to know can only be found by access to live data as the vehicle is running. The flash method, in my experience, doesn't ALWAYS tell you ALL the codes.

Yes, I have actually flashed the MIL/CEL, and then gone behind it with a scan tool, and gotten more codes, and a more complete story. Not sure how many members remember me from a decade ago, but I am a Ford Certified Tech, not a backyards parts changer.

I think we're saying about the same thing in different dialects. Ford called them hard faults and they didn't need to repeat to set, memory codes would be set if a fault occurred intermittently and stay for a set number of key cycles before clearing. Both would be set by a single occurrence and both should appear if ear by flash out. I think by 94 you'd have 3 digit codes, 111 10 111 is all pass, hard faults would be first, the the separator "10", then whatever memory codes. Some aftermarket scan tools would also display their guess of the most likely cause instead of just the codes. We fixed many vehicles from independents who followed their scan tool's instructions repeatedly before bringing their customer's cars to us. If it doesn't set a code, it just means whatever is wrong is within range- the first bunch of 2.9 Bronco II's we got ran like crap until we figured out there were 2 wires reversed on the TP sensors. Instead of about a volt at idle, they showed 5 volts, instead of 5 volts at WOT, they showed 1 volt. Some weird stuff used to get produced right before a new UAW contract was signed, not that they'd possibly deliberately sabotage vehicles, they were just nervous about the new contract. Is there a "wink-wink" imoji?

 

[gaz]

Delta Camshaft of Tacoma Washington will make you a custom reground camshaft with shipping for $180. If I understand you correctly.

I'm certain your set up will run on the stock computer.

I'm shocked to learn anyone really bored to 0.06" over . I would be concerned about the cylinder walls being too thin. I hope you are considering an engine oil cooler and 1 or 2 heat ranges lower plugs.

 

[fordwheelinman]

Delta Camshaft of Tacoma Washington will make you a custom reground camshaft with shipping for $180. If I understand you correctly.

I'm certain your set up will run on the stock computer.

I'm shocked to learn anyone really bored to 0.06" over . I would be concerned about the cylinder walls being too thin. I hope you are considering an engine oil cooler and 1 or 2 heat ranges lower plugs.

We had a mishap while boring, and had to sleeve one cylinder. While boring for the sleeve, it never went through the cylinder wall, so I'm certain the block is plenty strong enough.

I'm more worried about whether the speed density system will compensate for the increase in displacement. I know the MAP sensor is the same 2.9 to 7.5, so the sensor will work, but is the programming itself smart enough. I know there was a problem putting E303 cams in 5.0's with the earlier factory fuel injection, so I have my concerns with this.

 

[PetroleumJunkie412]

The EECIV in the 2.9 can't compensate for anything, save mild barometric pressure changes.

And even then, it's awful at it.

Get an aftermarket ECM if you plan on doing serious work like cam and displacement changes.

Megasquirt/Microsquirt are perfect.

 

[fordwheelinman]

The EECIV in the 2.9 can't compensate for anything, save mild barometric pressure changes.

And even then, it's awful at it.

Get an aftermarket ECM if you plan on doing serious work like cam and displacement changes.

Megasquirt/Microsquirt are perfect.

I didn't plan on it, the guy doing the work just kinda did it, so there's that.

It's also not my truck, and isn't intended for high performance use, so I'm trying to keep everything as stock as possible. Is there anyone who programs these older computers? Even if I had to pull it and send it to them, I just need it to run right, not scream to 7500 rpms.

 

[PetroleumJunkie412]

I have a Megasquirt on mine. Granted, it was done to add a turbo, but irrespective, it's a powerhouse of a system even on a stock motor. Modernizes the truck, immediately. I recommend them even for stock builds. Drastically lives up the truck.

If it's not your cup of tea, your only other hope would be to look for one of the California emissions computers and MAF sensors. Only EECIV system with factory built system flexibility.

 

[fordwheelinman]

I have a Megasquirt on mine. Granted, it was done to add a turbo, but irrespective, it's a powerhouse of a system even on a stock motor. Modernizes the truck, immediately. I recommend them even for stock builds. Drastically lives up the truck.

If it's not your cup of tea, your only other hope would be to look for one of the California emissions computers and MAF sensors. Only EECIV system with factory built system flexibility.

It's not that it's not my cup of tea, it's my dad's truck, and he is very old school. If it were a situation where I could buy a plug and play, ready to run unit, he'd go for it. But having to cut the factory harness, wire in a new plug, then program it, will turn him off immediately.

Now I have no idea how the megasquirt stuff works, but I did some perusing on the website, and nothing looks plug and play for these trucks. Maybe there is an option that I could email them about, but I haven't gotten that far into it yet.

I have thought about doing a MAF add on/conversion, but I'd need wiring diagrams in front of me to really be able to make that happen.

 

[PetroleumJunkie412]

It's not that it's not my cup of tea, it's my dad's truck, and he is very old school. If it were a situation where I could buy a plug and play, ready to run unit, he'd go for it. But having to cut the factory harness, wire in a new plug, then program it, will turn him off immediately.

Now I have no idea how the megasquirt stuff works, but I did some perusing on the website, and nothing looks plug and play for these trucks. Maybe there is an option that I could email them about, but I haven't gotten that far into it yet.

I have thought about doing a MAF add on/conversion, but I'd need wiring diagrams in front of me to really be able to make that happen.

I didnt cut my harness. I'm running a DIYPNP made for 5.0 fox body. Plugs directly into a 60 pin. There's a few wiring positions difference between the two, but otherwise it's a map and o2 sensor change, and you're good to go. Wideband was easy as hell with a Spartan.

The tune I wrote for 2.9 is uploaded in the 2.9 section. Free to use, abuse, etc.

It's really not a big ordeal.

If you do go the factory route, MAF wiring is in the haynes/Chiltons books. Nbd to do, but try finding the computer nowadays.

You're going to have more time and money in reprogramming an old eeciv than you will in a MS system, and still be outta luck when your 30+ year old chipsets start dying off.

Third option is carb.... I think Morana still sells the intakes.

 

[gaz]

fordwheelinman,.

This increase in displacement, even +0.06", is not significant enough to cause an issue with your stock 2.9L's computer.

You will ONLY need the computer worked on if it is a faulty unit. The stock injectors are good up to 250 hp.

A full race ported/polish, race valve work, headers/exhaust, high compression pistons with milled heads will run great on the stock computer on premium fuel.

This was an old thread, I hope everything goes together we'll. If it has been sitting, built for a bunch of years I would expect some gasket failures, otherwise out it together and turn it over

 

[bobbywalter]

fordwheelinman,.

This increase in displacement, even +0.06", is not significant enough to cause an issue with your stock 2.9L's computer.

You will ONLY need the computer worked on if it is a faulty unit. The stock injectors are good up to 250 hp.

A full race ported/polish, race valve work, headers/exhaust, high compression pistons with milled heads will run great on the stock computer on premium fuel.

This was an old thread, I hope everything goes together we'll. If it has been sitting, built for a bunch of years I would expect some gasket failures, otherwise out it together and turn it over

.
They are good for 250..


They usually fail to support 250 hp with oem 2.9 tune. The merkurs did ok

They tend to limit out on the fuel table even when the o2 demands more fuel.

19 pound injectors are fat on the bottom and trip over the dashpotting on bottom....but tweakable with lower map reporting via resistance values.

Tuning obd1 needs a Dyno.

Cam and turbo 2.9 was very hard to run out and to not crack heads.

 

[fordwheelinman]

fordwheelinman,.

This increase in displacement, even +0.06", is not significant enough to cause an issue with your stock 2.9L's computer.

You will ONLY need the computer worked on if it is a faulty unit. The stock injectors are good up to 250 hp.

A full race ported/polish, race valve work, headers/exhaust, high compression pistons with milled heads will run great on the stock computer on premium fuel.

This was an old thread, I hope everything goes together we'll. If it has been sitting, built for a bunch of years I would expect some gasket failures, otherwise out it together and turn it over

The short block was put together years ago, my dad finished it up with new gaskets right before he put it in sometime last summerish. I got the truck running, and sort of timed it, but it never ran 100%, and acted like it wasn't getting enough fuel. I suspect that with it sitting, I have lost an injector or two, or .aybe they are just a little sticky and not opening properly. Haven't heard back fro. The shop yet, but I know parts delays have cost them a lot of time recently. I'm thinking about biting the bullet and ordering a new set of injectors just so I know that isn't a problem. But I know from having worked with the man for a couple years, that the shop I have it at is owned and run by the best damn mechanic I've ever met. The man built a camaro drag car, with a tube chassis, hit and rolled it over a guardrail at over 120 mph, and walked away without much more than some sore muscles.

 

[gaz]

fordwheelinman,

If you have it running, not leaking any fluids, I would look at the timing, until I know that the timing is spot on; set the base timing on your engine after it has been warmed up to normal operational temperature. I even add the loads that I know the engine will feel like headlights, electric fan and the sound system.

Once you KNOW that it is timed correctly, you are miles ahead in troubleshooting.

 

[bobbywalter]

Any old injectors can be restricted...fire perfect....bit not flow correctly. Then get hammered shut as they clean up.

Many times I have seen injectors out of donor engines from the junkyard gooed up from this shit gas we have now.

I would certainly have them tested at minimim...

But for this project...new ones I would see as money well spent.

 

[fordwheelinman]

fordwheelinman,

If you have it running, not leaking any fluids, I would look at the timing, until I know that the timing is spot on; set the base timing on your engine after it has been warmed up to normal operational temperature. I even add the loads that I know the engine will feel like headlights, electric fan and the sound system.

Once you KNOW that it is timed correctly, you are miles ahead in troubleshooting.

No smoke, No leaks. I warmed it up, and timed it to factory timing, with the spout removed, so I know my procedure was right. It just never really seemed to hit on all cylinders 100%.

It's times like this I really miss OBD2 and the many things it will do with the right scan tool. Power balance, injector flow tests, output controls......o well.

 

[fordwheelinman]

Any old injectors can be restricted...fire perfect....bit not flow correctly. Then get hammered shut as they clean up.

Many times I have seen injectors out of donor engines from the junkyard gooed up from this shit gas we have now.

I would certainly have them tested at minimim...

But for this project...new ones I would see as money well spent.

I'm beginning to think I'd be miles ahead to buy some injectors and put them in. What do I have to lose other than a few hundred bucks that I'd probably spend building my sleeper Galaxie project?