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What Should I Do?


bobbywalter

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My credo
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Well I spent the spare days I had over the winter off school swapping a V8 into my Ranger, alot of money later and alot of time later...I get it running...drove it maybe 5kms in total (working out bugs)...and now the tranny is effed. Tried to fix it... nope. Ask the experts...and she is likely effed up. $1600 to fix...

Back story: I had a 4.0L with a 4R55E...which I eventually blew (which I accept full responsibility for, big tires and low gears), so I bought a 5R55E to swap in...spend some time and money on that and....it was a piece of shit, flared between shifts, dropped outta overdrive (also due to the big tires and underpowered engine).. so I said screw it I am dropping in a V8 powertrain...

So I did that and now I am back to square one. Except minus a couple thousand dollars and a couple hundred hours.

I am so frustrated I want to sell it...except I would never get anything near what I would want (of course)

I think in the past two years I have drove it maybe...150kms tops in total.

Its a nice truck...here is a pic:





What should I do: swap in a manual? How hard is that? Roll the dice with a junkyard engine? Any suggestions are welcome as I am bummed out...

P.S. Oh it is a 96 Ranger, with powertrain from a 96 Explorer, tranny is a 4R70W


sorry its gotten to this point.


question 1, was the powertrain rock solid and operating correctly before you swapped it in.?.?

question 2, how did the trans feel over the distance driven, fluid condition and flow rate through the return line from the cooler. is it possible you janked up the pump gear?

question 3, pressure tests and pcm communication are important things to know, did you take it to a shop for diagnosics for the 1600 dollar estimate or was it over the phone? that is unclear to me.


question 4, did you unplug the trans connector to make sure it defaults to 2nd gear? if there is no 2nd unplugged then you have to get it out of there and go thru it or get another know good trans. and you need to go thru th entire pcm connections




if it does go to 2nd and reverse you need to find out where you fawked up the harness...and the pcm needs to be looked at for damage.


the 4r70 is by far the strongest trans of the windsor era....stronger then even the c6.

the 4l80 is a fawking brute too.

and i kill them all. you have one of the bad stories, but even with a stronger trans you need spares. i am out of transmissions right now...and engines....


fix it. break it, fix it mo betta....break it........endless.
 


adsm08

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fix it. break it, fix it mo betta....break it........endless.
That reminds me of this one time at work, oddly enough also with a 4R70.

It lost drive, so we took it out, rebuilt it (not me, our trans master, I just took it out and put it in three times). I drove it, didn't make it a mile, lost all forward gears. Took it out, looked, forward clutch snap ring came out. Fixed it, put it in, drove it, got two miles, no over drive, took it out, looked, OD band came out of the case anchor. Fixed it, put it in, drove it up a hill 5 miles away, lost OD, took it out, looked, OD band broke and then the forward clutch snap ring came out again. Then we said "shitcan it, we are getting a reman".

That time it worked.
 

bobbywalter

TRS Technical Staff
TRS Event Staff
V8 Engine Swap
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Messages
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Reaction score
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Points
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Location
woodhaven mi
Vehicle Year
1988
Make / Model
FORD mostly
Engine Type
V8
Engine Size
BIGGER
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Total Lift
sawzall?
Tire Size
33-44
My credo
it is easier to fix and understand than "her"
yeah...you want a spiralok on those....i have ripped bands in half, welded planets and exploded the bulletproof diode sprag taking out the drum and case...


with a measly 300 hp and 35 in tires. drag racing dont have shit on four wheelin.
 

Dweano

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sorry its gotten to this point.

Me too, I did this swap to get away from the "weaker" V6 trannies. I replaced my blown 4R55E with a 5R55E with was slippy as hell, so I decided to do a V8 swap and solve my lack of power problem and my tranny problems...well that didn't pan out. I think I have driven a grand total of 150km in my truck in the past two years...the majority of it from my parents farm to my current place. Nothing but trouble and wasted money (rant over)


question 1, was the powertrain rock solid and operating correctly before you swapped it in.?.?

The guy I got it from says yes. I have been in contact with him and he has been helpful and just as confused as I have, I have no reason to believe he pawned junk off on me. Also the Expo was in a front end collision so it worked good up until that point. It only had 136,000 kms on it.

question 2, how did the trans feel over the distance driven, fluid condition and flow rate through the return line from the cooler. is it possible you janked up the pump gear?

The first time I drove it it felt alright, I was super paranoid at everything so I was driving slow, when it went to shift to overdrive it decellerated (almost like it shifted to second..now that I think about it, a high reving and slowing down effect, as if it went from 3-2 instead of 3-4, which I can't guarantee, could have been something else) BUT that was the very first time so I drove back to the shop (1-2 km round trip, all drives have been short) and added fluid. Which I apparently added too much (darn dipstick, fluid was clear (it was tranny fluid don't worry) and the stick always has oil on it...gah...) because it acted weird the second drive... it bubbled up out my breather (which I extended up to the engine bay) in spurts...like it spurted out twice. So i drove back to the shop and disconnected the line after my cooler. The fluid came out...healthy? I am not sure what it normally should be. It didn't come shooting out but it was flowing out. A litre bottle filled in probably 5 seconds about??? Then when I drove it the 3rd time (I think...its getting to be awhile ago now) it would only go in second gear. 4th time it was the same but when I put it in reverse to back up and turn around, I put it back in D...and nothing happened. Brings us to now.

I am not sure what janked up the pumped gear means?


question 3, pressure tests and pcm communication are important things to know, did you take it to a shop for diagnosics for the 1600 dollar estimate or was it over the phone? that is unclear to me.

Only a phone thing, didn't wanna pay $200 to tell them my tranny is messed up, that I know. I checked and there was no codes on it. The 4x4 lights do flash because the transfer case from the Expo (AWD 4407 I believe) doesn't hook up to my ranger t-case harness. I didn't think leaving that disconnected would hurt (it drove the first couple times so I don't think that should matter) I am unsure what pressure tests you mean? I can do any tests needed tho?

question 4, did you unplug the trans connector to make sure it defaults to 2nd gear? if there is no 2nd unplugged then you have to get it out of there and go thru it or get another know good trans. and you need to go thru th entire pcm connections

No I hadn't heard of that. Which connector do I unplug? There are a couple on the tranny if I remember right?


if it does go to 2nd and reverse you need to find out where you fawked up the harness...and the pcm needs to be looked at for damage.

That would be awesome...even going forward would make me happy haha. Wiring is annoying, but alot less annoying than rebuilding a tranny

the 4r70 is by far the strongest trans of the windsor era....stronger then even the c6.

the 4l80 is a fawking brute too.

and i kill them all. you have one of the bad stories, but even with a stronger trans you need spares. i am out of transmissions right now...and engines....


fix it. break it, fix it mo betta....break it........endless.
That reminds me of this one time at work, oddly enough also with a 4R70.

It lost drive, so we took it out, rebuilt it (not me, our trans master, I just took it out and put it in three times). I drove it, didn't make it a mile, lost all forward gears. Took it out, looked, forward clutch snap ring came out. Fixed it, put it in, drove it, got two miles, no over drive, took it out, looked, OD band came out of the case anchor. Fixed it, put it in, drove it up a hill 5 miles away, lost OD, took it out, looked, OD band broke and then the forward clutch snap ring came out again. Then we said "shitcan it, we are getting a reman".

That time it worked.
Not exactly what I wanna hear...haha

But THANK YOU all for replying. This whole process has been quite disheartening. I know enough about vehicles but auto tranny's have always been a mystery to me. I don't know enough to do much myself. I am guessing I will end up having to teach myself alot. I have a feeling it will need to come out

Also...I replaced the solenoids...no change and replaced the valvebody (which I was SURE would fix it) and no change either, that one really surprised me)

I did read the whole 4R70W rebuild diary on Explorerforums, it didn't seem too too complicated. If worse comes to worse I think I would take things out and put them back in in the same order. I mean what would I have to lose right?
 

adsm08

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4WD
Tire Size
31X10.50X15
Janked up: Adj, to be cocked up, effeed up, messed up, broken, or other wise damaged.

The plug in question would be the big white one (well it's not that big, but it's bigger than the rest), at the passenger rear corner of the trans.

You can check pressure to the individual clutches at the pressure test ports scattered across the case, but you need a gauge capable of reading +300 PSI (not sure what that is in BAR, but it's a lot), and some of them you will need a scanner to command the solenoids to get fluid flow.


If you replaced the valve body and solenoids you could still have a wiring problem. I am still leaning towards an air test though.


And I didn't tell that story to be discouraging. That particular unit was demon possessed. That story there was not the first time we had had issues like that with that trans, and I have never seen a 4R70 do stuff like that before.
 

bobbywalter

TRS Technical Staff
TRS Event Staff
V8 Engine Swap
TRS Technical Advisor
TRS Banner 2012-2015
TRS 20th Anniversary
Ugly Truck of Month
TRS Event Participant
Joined
Aug 9, 2007
Messages
23,470
Reaction score
4,667
Points
113
Location
woodhaven mi
Vehicle Year
1988
Make / Model
FORD mostly
Engine Type
V8
Engine Size
BIGGER
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Total Lift
sawzall?
Tire Size
33-44
My credo
it is easier to fix and understand than "her"
pull the big plug and see if it has second gear default.



re reading it looks like your saying low 1 = reverse as well?

that suggests a cross leak....if it was before you messed with the valve body, then you may have broke the case internally somewhere or stressed it enought during the r@r that caused a crossleak issue.
 

Dweano

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Just reiterating: My next step is to disconnect the main big plug and see what happens, and also I can drop the valve and hit the FWD pressure port with compressed air to see what happens?

bobbywalter you are correct, when I put the gear selector in "1" it goes in reverse. It started doing that the exact same time I lost forward. I was sitting on the side of the road, went to put it in forward...nothing. So I put it in 1 and I went backwards almost into the ditch. The two things happened at the same time. Everything was working properly up until the "roadside incident"
 

bobbywalter

TRS Technical Staff
TRS Event Staff
V8 Engine Swap
TRS Technical Advisor
TRS Banner 2012-2015
TRS 20th Anniversary
Ugly Truck of Month
TRS Event Participant
Joined
Aug 9, 2007
Messages
23,470
Reaction score
4,667
Points
113
Location
woodhaven mi
Vehicle Year
1988
Make / Model
FORD mostly
Engine Type
V8
Engine Size
BIGGER
Transmission
Automatic
2WD / 4WD
4WD
Total Lift
sawzall?
Tire Size
33-44
My credo
it is easier to fix and understand than "her"

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