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2000 3.0FFV misfire


Campbell5149

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Hey guys, I'll start off by saying I'm an auto tech of 10 years experience, ASE certs ect.... now on to the problem:

I've got a 2000 ranger 3.0 I bought from a customer a year ago with blown head gaskets. I rebuilt the motor top to bottom, new everything. It's been good but it's developed a hard start, severe misfire. initially found a clogged fuel filter, replaced it but didnt solve it. threw a 303, ended up replacing an injector. started it up and ran just as bad with a 305. replaced the injector on 5 now its missing on 3 and 5, which i verified by pulling wires and listening for difference in how it ran. Still misses on those cylinders yet will not throw any codes. Coil is hitting, spark at the plug....

Tested and known good:

Coil pack
CMP
Injectors
Compression
wires/plugs

pulled valve cover to verify rockers are functioning. Used a noid light on the injectors, all fire. I'm totally at a loss with this truck. Anyone got a thought?
 
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Campbell5149

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should also add, tested injectors for resistance, within tolerance
 

RonD

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I know the 3.0l heads did have floating valve seat issues but I think that was around 2002 - 2006.

#3 and #5 spark plugs tell you anything?

If you crank engine without coil hooked up do #3 and say #2 plugs have the same amount of fuel on them.

There is the "clear flooded engine" routine that can be used to check for fuel leaking into the intake.
Turn on key
Press gas pedal to the floor and hold it there, TPS goes to +4.6v, with no CKP sensor pulse, computer turns off injectors, but keeps spark on
Crank engine

If engine randomly fires there is a fuel leak into the intake.
If you release gas pedal engine should fire up


It is odd you are not getting the 30x codes anymore, almost makes you think PCM issue.
Does the PCM respond to reading normally, no delays or odd readings.
If you unplug MAF do you get the CEL?
 
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Campbell5149

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#3 and #5 plugs appear to have normal burn, maybe a little lean, but not anything I would condemn. I am surprised at the lack of codes as well. I'm leaning towards pcm, rather than head issue soley to the fact of 1) i built the motor and inspected the valve seats when it was apart, and 2) it passes compression and leak down tests. I'll go try the fuel leakdown test, although I don't believe the issue is there.

adding the injectors all ohmed out at .021-.032

With the MAF unplugged, it did not throw a code. good call on that. Looks like it's gonna need a PCM. But with a misfire, i should lack spark or fuel. which it has both. All I can think is maybe the PCM is retarding or advancing the timing too far? it has started backfiring on the exhaust side, this thing is a strange case
 

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And if it was spark timing the Paired cylinder should also be effected
I.e. 3/4 and 5/1

Have you tried reversing those wires on the coil?

Waste spark does "technically" have a "weaker" spark on one of the paired plug wires since they are hooked up in series.
one spark plug sparks from electrode to ground the other from ground to electrode, but because of the voltages it shouldn't matter.

But I have known a failed coil pack to effect only 1 cylinder/spark plug.

And remember the "new" rule:
New no longer means "it works", New now means NO ONE has ever tested it, you are the first.

Our demand for lower pricing has forced manufacturers to drop Quality Control Depatments.
They now add warranties and make you the unpaid Quality Control worker, lol.
"Doesn't work right out of the box??"...."here ya go, test this one for us, free of course" :)
 

Campbell5149

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I'll go out and try reversing them. Still theres no codes. but I did run the CFE test and it worked as it should, no start at WOT. This will be the 2nd used PCM to fail....
 

Campbell5149

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wire swapping did not show a difference.
 

Campbell5149

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Update:

Borrowed a scanner from ford (i have some friends) and ran a self test sequence on it. still nothing i can really put my finger on but:

P1116 ECT out of range
P1780 TCSC out of range
P1703 Brake Switch out of range
P1127 Downstream O2 not tested; too cold
P1408 EGR flow

I'm aware of the EGR issue, its closed so no issue there, The trans codes are useless, the only threat i see is a ECT causing issues, I've seen them reap havoc on chevys, but i can unplug it, reset the KAM and no avail. still a misfire. I'm honestly about to take it off the road and part it out and just drive my other truck.
 

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If it wasn't at temp when you ran the test the ECT code should be ignored. Look at the PID for ECT, if it's reading properly it's not your problem.

If you still have the IDS go into Power Train, and run a relative compression. If it passes go into Oscilloscope Functions and check the cam/crank relation.

It would be the first time I have seen this particular symptom set caused by a cam sensor issue, but it wouldn't be the first time I saw one do something strange. The magnets come unglued and make the signal do strange stuff. You should be able to see that on the o-scope. You might need to nab a VMM for all that.

The relative compression test might show up an issue in that system before doing the o-scope tests. If there is an issue with the cam/crank signals it will usually, not always, but usually, fail and given an error message about cam/crank syncronization.

BTW, where is this thing? Sounds like my kind of issue, I love getting my hands on the basket cases.
 

Campbell5149

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If it wasn't at temp when you ran the test the ECT code should be ignored. Look at the PID for ECT, if it's reading properly it's not your problem.

If you still have the IDS go into Power Train, and run a relative compression. If it passes go into Oscilloscope Functions and check the cam/crank relation.

It would be the first time I have seen this particular symptom set caused by a cam sensor issue, but it wouldn't be the first time I saw one do something strange. The magnets come unglued and make the signal do strange stuff. You should be able to see that on the o-scope. You might need to nab a VMM for all that.

The relative compression test might show up an issue in that system before doing the o-scope tests. If there is an issue with the cam/crank signals it will usually, not always, but usually, fail and given an error message about cam/crank syncronization.

BTW, where is this thing? Sounds like my kind of issue, I love getting my hands on the basket cases.
this truck is in south carolina. I'm a body electronics guy, I get all the hard ones, and I never thought it'd be my own truck that'd kick my butt. I'll go up to the shop and run some tests on it.

ECT is a false code in that case, it was not up to temp.
I didn't think it'd be a cmp issue so much as a injector driver issue

i should point out, ive got the star scanner, not IDS. It's a lot more limited as to what it can do. It loads the PIDs, I can run tests for faults, ran the PID for cmp/ckp, no fault. also inj 1-6 no fault. this ones a strange case
 
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Gremlins. That is all.
 

Campbell5149

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Ok update on this thing:

I brought home my solus, ran a cylinder contribution test on it, it showed #2 and #4 having a misfire count, on the graph it was almost base lining. NOW the interesting part. I shut it off, didn't touch it, restarted it, and now its #2 and #5. It has spark, and it has fuel. I'm starting to think it's PCM failure at this point. its so erratic it cant be component failure
 

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I would try to force a misfire code from PCM.
 

Campbell5149

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I ended up pushing it to the back of the lot to deal with some other time. It wont even start now. I'll order a PCM for it and see in a week or so
 

Campbell5149

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Ok so I bought a PCM for the truck, to no avail. $180 bucks wasted. So I came in saturday and dragged the truck into the shop so I could get some uninterrupted time with it, and heres what I found. I ran cylinder leak test using my compression gauge hose hooked to direct air line pressure (160lbs) and spun the cylinders to the compression stroke one by one. I found that on the compression stroke when the vavles SHOULD be closed, That cyl numbers 2,3 and 6 were leaking air through the exhaust. Pulled the heads, found valves had pulled through the seats. pictures included. I hope if anything, my trials will help someone else experiencing these symptoms. I'll send those heads off to a buddy and have him do a valve job on them, probably get the polished and ported while he's at it :stirthepot:


EDIT: I should add, yes I know the heads and valves look rough, it had water in the cylinders at one point due to sitting with no hood or intake, tarp blew off. and yes, I am aware it clearly has oil consumption issues, but it runs good doesn't smoke so I don't care. I'm going to try to pin down my piston slap while its apart too. any ideas RonD or Adam?
 

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