Here we go again!

cbxer55 · Jan 16, 2017

Hey folks,

Haven't been here for a few years, since I have a 2004 Lightning as well. Still have my 98 3.0 V-6 Ranger. Been running pretty dang good lately, put a new fuel pump and filter in her in early December, computer has been clean ever since, no codes and all monitors in the ready mode.

But, drove it 100 miles early today, and all was fine. Ran like a raped ape, as it usually always does. Modified exhaust and aftermarket intake.

Problem is, I put her in the garage at 1830, went in, got cleaned up to go out for dinner, now it cranks but won't start. Tried replacing the fuel pump relay, as I have several. Nothing. It's got a new IAC, DPFE, IAT and plugs. When I turn on the key, I still get the loud click from behind me. Will check fuel pressure tomorrow when it's light out again. But don't suspect a brand new fuel pump went south on me in one month.

It did this to me before, back in 2009. But, my sister borrowed it from me for four years, and never complained about it once. Got it back in 2013, and it's been good since, except for the lean codes, which a new fuel pump fixed. Just all of the sudden, out of the blue, it's back. Never did figure out what ailed it back when.

Just put the new fuel pump in, new back brake shoes and new back tires. Don't want to have it towed to a scrap yard yet, it runs too darn good.

What's ailing it? :icon_confused:

cbxer55 · Jan 17, 2017

Further info.

It was good until yesterday. Drove to a cigar bar for a beer and stogie. Started right up when I left two hours later. When I got home, I went inside for about 15 minutes, had difficulty starting it afterwards. Had to play with the throttle to get it running. After going to din-din, it started right up. Drove it home and parked it for the night.

Started right up next afternoon. Went for drive around curvy road, about 100 miles. Stopped halfway to relieve myself, it started right up. Drove home and parked it for about 15 minutes. Had troubles starting it once again.

Decided to try something. So when I parked it at home the last time, tried starting it at 5 minutes. Started right up. At 10 minutes there was a hesitation. At 15 it almost didn't start. At 30 minutes, it wouldn't start.

It's almost like something needs to be hot in order to function properly. But what? :dunno:

alwaysFlOoReD · Jan 17, 2017

Leaking injectors? Next time it won't start hold the pedal to the floor and try starting. That puts it in flooded engine mode and it shouldn't start. If it does or tries to, then there is excess gas in the intake.

lil_Blue_Ford · Jan 17, 2017

So you left out some potentially important details.... what beer and what cigar? Haha! (I'm a fellow beer and cigar lover)

Seriously though, that is an interesting problem. If it was an older truck, I would suspect the TFI module, but I don't know that yours would have anything like that annoying module. I would suspect it's some sort of sensor that's failing or that maybe the IAC is sticking when cold, but I'm just guessing. Might be worth trying to investigate some of those things though. You could take the MAF out of the equation by unplugging it, I've heard that it can cause failure to start. It will run poorly without the MAF plugged in since the computer will run in limp mode, but the next time it fails to start, maybe try unplugging it and see what happens. Maybe try tapping on the IAC in case it kinda stuck, I have seen new ones not work right out of the box.

Another thought is what is the condition of the battery cables? Just because they look ok doesn't always mean that they are, I've had a few corrode to junk inside the insulation and that can cause all sorts of strange issues. Enough that I usually start with grounds and battery cables in trying to diagnose a problem. I've taken to making my own battery cables out of welding cable, it's high flex, high energy transfer, and better quality than the packaged junk on the rack in the parts store.

Sent from my kite using a trebuchet

cbxer55 · Jan 17, 2017

Started up just a little bit ago. Wasn't a smooth start, ran like it wasn't hitting on all six cylinders. Then it cleared up and is purring like a kitten once again.

Fuel pressure is at 62 psi running, 60 key on engine off. No codes, all monitors ready. System voltage 13.8 on a two month old battery.

I did try to start it with the petal to the floor several times, nothing. IAC is a very expensive Hitachi I bought last year. This truck has, for the 16 years I've owned it, eaten IAC's like they are cheap candy. This one has outlasted all the cheap Vato Zone units by a year.

I tried, last night, unplugging the IAC, wouldn't start. I did try unplugging the MAF, wouldn't start.

When it started a bit ago, I let it run for 30 minutes, then shut it down. Will go out and try to start it again in a bit, see if it's something repetitive. If it does start again, will take it for drive, then let it sit for 30 minutes, see what transpires.

I just can't figure out these damn intermittent things. I don't use cheap fuel (fuel with corn) in it since it has a modified exhaust, intake, and a chip on the PCM. I did try removing the chip, nothing. So it's not the problem.

At least I still have my Lightning. I don't like driving it this time of year, it has drag radials on the back that are not supposed to be moved below 15 degrees. And I don't drive it in the rain, and it's going to rain tonight while I'm at work. :annoyed:

Oh well, I'll keep at it. Loaded the fuel tank with some fuel injector cleaner while it was running a bit ago. Probably won't do anything, but it won't hurt either.

Rearanger · Jan 18, 2017

When it doesn't start have you checked for spark? Or have you sprayed starting fluid into throttle body?

Try to eliminate spark or fuel.

cbxer55 · Jan 18, 2017

Rearanger said:
When it doesn't start have you checked for spark? Or have you sprayed starting fluid into throttle body?

Try to eliminate spark or fuel.

I have and spark exists. And yes on the starting fluid, it will start and burn off the starting fluid, then die. Endlessly until the can is empty.

Don't know what the problem was, but it's starting fine again. Is it possible I overheated the IAC? I had gone to a local park on a cold day to smoke a cigar, and sat in the truck, idling with the heater on low. Probably near two hours. While it's an expensive Japanese IAC (Hitachi), I think it can still be overworked if idling for too long. My Lightning is a 2004, and I've had to replace it twice in the 8 years I've owned it. Replaced the IAC on the Ranger probably 8 times in the 16 years I've owned it. Mainly because Auto Zone IAC's suck (made in Mexico), and never knew they had the premium Hitachi unit until last year.

I am going to put a spare IAC in the truck, and next time it happens try switching it out. See what transpires. Cause otherwise I am totally at a loss as to what happened.

Back in 2009, I had starting troubles. It would readily start once it was hot, but once it cooled off, forget about it. Would kill batteries trying to get it started. When it did start, it seemed like it was running on 3 cylinders. Then over a five minute period, the other 3 would kick in and it would purr like a kitten.

This time, it started after 5 minutes, started with hesitation after 10 and would not start after 30 minutes and 3 hours. Next morning, VROOM! :dunno:

Rearanger · Jan 18, 2017

I doubt IAC when starting fluid starts it. IAC is air supply, not fuel.

I would attach a fuel pressure gauge and monitor the pressure at all the points where the engine does or does not start. Residual pressure does not count, so you might have to drain the pressure down and then try pressure test.

Could even be a fuel pump relay.

If you could jump the fuel pump when the engine doesn't start that might tell you something.

I'm not sure if the crank angle sensor controls fuel or spark - someone else maybe can help.

cbxer55 · Jan 18, 2017

I know the IAC is for air control. Idle Air Control. Anyhow, the truck will run with the IAC unplugged, so I tried starting it like that: nothing. I did try changing the fuel pump relay at the time the truck was dead, as I keep a spare in the truck. Nothing. At the time it would not start, I could hear the click from the back about 3 seconds after turning the key on. So I assumed everything was good regarding fuel.

Anyhow, haven't been able to duplicate it again. Started up first thing this morning, started two more times since, no problem.

I hate intermittent issues! It's impossible to fix them if it doesn't happen consistently every time. :annoyed:

Just got to say, when it's running it's one great running truck. I refuse to trade it for anything else, I like it that much. Aside from the exhaust, intake and chip, I've also put a large Hellwig anti-sway bar on the rear and Lakewood traction bars, as it used to have a bad wheel hop problem. No more, got sticky sport tires on the back, and the truck handles a twisty road awesome. The other day, on the curvy road I like to drive, a guy in some type of sports car was trying to get past me, and he couldn't. Kept leaving him behind in the corners. ROFLMAO!!!!

You see from my signature, I have a Lightning. When it comes to going around corners, I prefer the Ranger over the Lightning. The Lightning is a beast in a straight line, but it's extreme front-to-rear weight bias makes it a pig in the twisties.

cbxer55 · Jan 19, 2017

Doing it again today. Wouldn't start when I went to leave for work. Cranks energetically but doesn't even try to kick over. Hopefully it's still doing it tomorrow, and maybe I can start figuring out what the problem is. AGAIN!!!

cbxer55 · Jan 20, 2017

This is driving me berserk. Think I'm going to scrap this truck.

Wouldn't start Thursday afternoon when I went to work. Cranked it over and over, no dice.

Got home, it started right up, first turn of the key.

WTF????? :dunno:

stmitch · Jan 20, 2017

Maybe a fluky thing happening with the Throtle Position Sensor?

JP02XLT · Jan 20, 2017

I had a similar problem on a Jeep Wrnagler, it would die, not start, crank, fire up on ether, after a long troubleshooting period, I found it had a weak crankshaft position sensor which controlls the injector firing, replaced it and it has been solid since. Just a thought.

JP02XLT

cbxer55 · Jan 20, 2017

JP02XLT said:
I had a similar problem on a Jeep Wrnagler, it would die, not start, crank, fire up on ether, after a long troubleshooting period, I found it had a weak crankshaft position sensor which controlls the injector firing, replaced it and it has been solid since. Just a thought.

JP02XLT

Could be, that's the only sensor I have not replaced on this truck. For now, it was running, and when the wires to the IAC are wiggled, the engines stumbles. So, I pulled the harness up to relieve the strain on them, and tie-wrapped it to the radiator hose. We'll see what happens now.

JP02XLT · Jan 20, 2017

The Jeep gave no codes or engine light, just stalled at times and would not start, or might fire right back up you never knew, Any way good luck with your troubleshooting, I know the Jeep was a good week of testing everything under the hood, and chasing your tail gets old.

JP02XLT

Here we go again!

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