Random unrelated transmission questions (M50D-R1 4WD Transmission)

I have a couple random questions about my transmission so I figured I'd put them all in one thread:

1. Since the weather has warmed, when taking off in first before the clutch is fully engaged (right around the grabbing point) the vehicle makes somewhat of a strange spooling/groaning sound (like the sound of an electric vehicle taking off at full throttle) but it only makes the sound in first, I'm assuming its a clutch issue because first gear is the gear that has to be slipped the most, I was just wondering if anybody can tell me more specifically what it may be. The clutch still grabs strong.

2. Another somewhat related question: When I bought the vehicle the transmission seemed to shift close to perfect, the temperature was around 35 degrees outside. Then the temperature outside dropped to -15F, and it became much more difficult to shift gears, so I drained the old fluid (it came out black, no metal shavings though) and refilled it with a Semi-synthetic multi-spec ATF (Mobil 1). Now that its warming up it seems to be more difficult again to shift gears (1st gear, 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 2nd). My thought was to try changing the fluid again but my question is this: what would be better for warmer weather; Valvoline DexIII/Merc MaxLife or Motorcraft Mercon V (my understanding is that I have carbon fiber synchros)? Is there anything else I can do to help make the gear shifter move into gears more smoothly? Is there a possibility that I have a serious issue like synchros going out?

3. The Hurst Billet/Plus Truck Shifter sounds and looks like a really nice mod, and looks to only cost around $225. How much worse is the noise I keep reading about? Is there any way to dampen the noise or make it less noticeable? Is it so highly noticeable that it's annoying? Does anybody know of any problems or damage that these shifters have been known to cause? Can anybody who owns one chime in with some pros and cons?

The truck in question is a 2003 Ford Ranger 4.0 V6, 5 speed manual, 4x4 (electronic T-case), with about 67,000 miles. I think that does it for now. Thanks.

Nobody has a hurst shifter?

I have one.

I haven't defeated the noise problem... other than playing the
stereo louder...

AD

AllanD said:

I have one.

I haven't defeated the noise problem... other than playing the
stereo louder...

AD

Click to expand...

Update after making the post above earlier today I got ticked
off at the noise.

realizing several facts:
1)My transmission had been "professored" by the master (ahhh... Me!
and I know there's nothing "wrong" inside it and ALL previous "metal"
was carefully washed off all the internals.

2)that someone (mabey me again?) added several rare earth
magnets to strategic places inside the trans to capture any metal

3)the plastic shifter bushings I'm most concerned about getting
softened by any other lubricant are resting comfortably in the
top center drawer of my toolbox... where they won't get gear
oil on them... (Remember: Hurst shifter)

All that being said, to make a long story short I drained the Mercon5
out of my plastic synchro Mazda transmission and refilled it with
75W-90 Mobil1 Synthetic Racing Gear Oil that is very nearly the last
of the two cases I was given by Galles Racing back in the early 90's

It cut the noise by 2/3-3/4.

It's still not as quiet as it was before the Hurst shifter,
but in numbs the noise.


AD

Considering the general consensus on the atf vs gear oil vs 0w30 crankcase issue (atf wins) I suppose I should probably rule out the purchase of a hurst shifter if gear oil is the only noise remedy.

"The general consensus" is something I created and therefore something
I'm not entirely bound to...

As I said the primary reason for NOT using the thicker oil in a Mazda trans is not that the gear oil won't get where it's going but it's superior ability to also carry Debris to those restricted areas...

And As I said the primary debris to be concerned with are plastic chips from the eventual & inevetible failure of the lower shift pivot bushing.

As my shift bushings are not IN my transmission they are extreemly unlikely to find themselves plugging oil passages...

Lastly I added several small rare earth magnets where the
oil MUST flow past them (but not where they will cause a restriction)
and capture any ferrous metal fragments, unlikely as I assembled my
trans from previously "run-in" parts.

In nearly two months since assembly it has made NO metal to be stuck
to the drain plug magnet... seems like I did it right...

I've often said gear oil is OK, if you are absolutely sure
about the condition of the trans.
There is only a few ways to be that sure... and most involve having the trans completely apart.

as for the noise? I might be less tolerant of noise than you.
a noise that drives me stark raving mad (if not already stark raving mad)
might be unnoticed by you....

I would have used some Redline MTL but I had the Mobil1 on hand...

I also could have used some of the rare and elusive Merkur Synthetic
but I only had two quarts of that lovely 65W-80 stuff and I didn't
want to mix it with anything....

The other issuewith gear oil is that the "Vent" on an M5OD-R1 is out through the stub lever seal and out around the "rubber plugs", either way the stench permeates the cabin.

with the Hurst and a trans that's modified with an actual vent line it's another
non-issue...

Still running gear oil is taking a chance, but since I build transmissions
it's a risk I'll take.... if only for peace & quiet

You'll also see make mention of "shift quality issues" runing different oils from those specified...

Mine seems to work fine.

AD

While I enjoyed the detailed discussion...does the OP's issue sound like a simple slave problem to anyone else but me?

"seems to be more difficult again to shift gears (1st gear, 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 2nd). "

Only reason I mention that is from one of the 93's I picked up. Puked all its ATF out the rear seal, wouldn't go into any gear while running. Towed it home (it had sat for weeks) with the engine running (for PS and PB) and parked it. 2 days later, I get in, start it up, push the clutch in, drive it around the block - flawless. Get to the stop sign, won't go into any gear. Shut it off, start it in gear, no creeping, let clutch out, park it. Next day, repeat. Would NOT shift (without rpm matching) after it got warm.
Threw a rear seal and a slave at it, sealed the shifter bushing plugs and drove it for ~ 6 months until it stripped the gears, nursed it home in 4th and bought a used MO5D from a a guy on here. That truck had 134k. At 67K, I can't fathom an internal failure in the OP's MO5D, unless it got run dry. Slave, I could believe.

"when taking off in first before the clutch is fully engaged (right around the grabbing point) the vehicle makes somewhat of a strange spooling/groaning sound (like the sound of an electric vehicle taking off at full throttle) but it only makes the sound in first, I'm assuming its a clutch issue"

Yep, this sounds like a benign clutch "hoot" noise. Mine will do this after periods of sitting in high humidity/rain. I liken it to rotors getting a film of rust, making them grabby for the first stop or two. Give it a good high revving hard launch in 2nd with a lot of slippage and see if it quits after that "scrubbing". Mine has had this "hoot" since new, still original everything. Comes and goes with the weather and disuse.

Earl43P said:

While I enjoyed the detailed discussion...does the OP's issue sound like a simple slave problem to anyone else but me?

"seems to be more difficult again to shift gears (1st gear, 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 2nd). "

Only reason I mention that is from one of the 93's I picked up. Puked all its ATF out the rear seal, wouldn't go into any gear while running. Towed it home (it had sat for weeks) with the engine running (for PS and PB) and parked it. 2 days later, I get in, start it up, push the clutch in, drive it around the block - flawless. Get to the stop sign, won't go into any gear. Shut it off, start it in gear, no creeping, let clutch out, park it. Next day, repeat. Would NOT shift (without rpm matching) after it got warm.
Threw a rear seal and a slave at it, sealed the shifter bushing plugs and drove it for ~ 6 months until it stripped the gears, nursed it home in 4th and bought a used MO5D from a a guy on here. That truck had 134k. At 67K, I can't fathom an internal failure in the OP's MO5D, unless it got run dry. Slave, I could believe.

"when taking off in first before the clutch is fully engaged (right around the grabbing point) the vehicle makes somewhat of a strange spooling/groaning sound (like the sound of an electric vehicle taking off at full throttle) but it only makes the sound in first, I'm assuming its a clutch issue"

Yep, this sounds like a benign clutch "hoot" noise. Mine will do this after periods of sitting in high humidity/rain. I liken it to rotors getting a film of rust, making them grabby for the first stop or two. Give it a good high revving hard launch in 2nd with a lot of slippage and see if it quits after that "scrubbing". Mine has had this "hoot" since new, still original everything. Comes and goes with the weather and disuse.

Click to expand...

Wow, thanks a lot for your input. I'd like to hope that its not something internal, I'd like to hope its not the slave either, since I've only had the truck since February, but if it were the slave how much am I looking to spend to fix it (average shop rate here is $70/hour). Should I considering bleeding the clutch (I'm going to be driving it 3300 miles round trip to California in August). Will bleeding the clutch help anything? As far as the clutch noise goes, its the only vehicle I've driven that makes the sound.

Allan D:
What would you equate the noise with? I'm sure it would be noticeable to me as other people on the forums have mentioned the noise. Often I do have my music turned up, but there are times I have a headache and the only thing I really want to hear is the engine. I really don't know a whole lot about the condition of my transmission, given my original post it may be questionable. I also don't know a whole lot about transmissions outside of how to operate them and what they do. I do really want a Hurst Shifter because it sounds a world better than stock, but I don't really want to deal with extra noise.

Well today, I went ahead and changed the transmission oil again. Went ahead and filled it with Valvoline DexIII/Merc until it started to dribble back out (2 3/4 quarts). The old fluid came out dark but not black, absolutely no shavings on the drain plug. The DexIII/Merc seems to be an improvement over the Mobil 1 Multi-ATF fluid (meets requirements for Mercon, Mercon V), although I still don't know whether or not the Motorcraft Mercon V would be be any better, (I'm going to go ahead and leave it because it goes into every gear pretty easily now).

But yet another random question popped up in my head while driving today. In my previous car brass shift bushings were made to tighten up shifts, and make them much more clean and precise (eliminated clunkinees). It was an extremely popular mod on that forum for anybody who had the 6 speed version of that car. My question is this:
Is there anybody who manufactures brass shifter bushings for the Ranger? I'd be willing to bet that I would see very similar results in the Ranger by removing the old rubber shift bushings and putting in new brass ones (if somebody makes them).

I've since determined that the bulk of the remaining noises I hear are
from my T-case which had been filled with bright "Hawiian Punch" red
Motorcraft MerconV, but came out looking rather plum/metal flake colored.

The fact that the chips are Non-magnetic is a positive indication to me
it's bits of one or more of the Manganese-alloy components inside the T-case...

Annd as it's a constant spinning noise that is transmission output shaft speed
related, NOT "road speed" related, I'm thinking one or more of the
planet gears, which ALWAYS spin when the engine is turning.

On gear oil the transmission noise is about what it would be with the foam isolator
missing from inside the shift boot.

AD