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Overridin/fixing the PATS in my 2004


magrasjc

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Hello!
More adventure in fixing my 2004 ranger.
See previous posts for your torture dose.
The attached picture is from the far driver's side with bottom panel removed. Do you install here? (Ham radio?)
Diagram in Haynes / Chilton has only mention of "personality module". No mention of inside fuse box.

I am thinking that a remote start system(cool start rs1-g5) will allow me to bypass the car/padlock that shows up when I turn the key and get no sounds what so ever.
I need to map the cables of the coolstart. I have the rs1-7_g5 PDF for installation but I want to know more about it and the details of the install to do it myself.

Bulldog not useful: http://www.bulldogsecurity.com/bdnew/vehiclewiringdiagrams.aspx
Thanks in advance,
JC Magras
 

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RonD

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RAP-remote personality module is for Keyless entry, used to be called RKE

There is no by-pass for PATS, Ford's remote start units use an "Electronic PATS Key" which you add to the PATS system just like a regular PATS key, so when Remote Start is activated Computer "reads" the electronic key and allows the start up.
 

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RAP-remote personality module is for Keyless entry, used to be called RKE

There is no by-pass for PATS, Ford's remote start units use an "Electronic PATS Key" which you add to the PATS system just like a regular PATS key, so when Remote Start is activated Computer "reads" the electronic key and allows the start up.
This still needed a PATS key to drive though correct? The engine would shutoff if you try to put it in gear without inserting the proper pats programmed key?
 

magrasjc

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Thx for your help.
I am trying to install, still in planning stage, a generic not Ford specific crimestopper unit to go around the padlocked car light that illuminates when I turn the key.
I have an original Ford key.

Is there a way to diagnose the pats system because I heard a power draining clack sound from the glove compartment where the computer should be on the other side of the firewall

Thx in advance,
JC Magras
 

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Can you start from the beginning?
Where are you located, and is this a US Ranger or the T6 international version?
What have you done to troubleshoot?

Installing a separate unit won't fix the root problem here.
 
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RonD

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This still needed a PATS key to drive though correct? The engine would shutoff if you try to put it in gear without inserting the proper pats programmed key?
Yes, remote start allows engine to warm up but steering wheel is still locked and engine would die if you tried to put it into gear, and depending on the remote start unit engine would shut off if you unlock or opened a door
So you do need a working PATS key to restart and drive

Better units also have engine temp and oil pressure shut offs, i.e. over heating shuts off engine, no oil pressure shuts off engine
 

magrasjc

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The goal here is to cut out the PATS system

Thx for your help.
This <a href='http://www.bulldogsecurity.com/bdnew/vehiclewiringdiagrams.aspx'>link</a> suggests at the bottom that I need an extra module for our favorite truck.

How do i know that this will cut out the PATS system
or B: diagnose the PATS system?
The engine computer can not be read?

Thx in advance,
JC Magras
 
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RonD has tried to explain that it is not an easy process to over ride PATS on a Ford.

Best effort would be to fix what you have or to get a locksmith to get you a key recognized because it seems your OEM key is no longer recognized by PATS.

Ray
 

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Yes, +1 ^^^^

Also in a 2004 and up Ranger you have a full digital instrument cluster which is part of the security system and PATS, i.e. you can't change the instrument cluster or computer(PCM) without these two parts being Remarried by a Ford Dealer.
Engine will not start without correct instrument cluster plugged in, it has an ID number encoded, or with instrument cluster unplugged for that matter.
This prevents the Odometer roll back issues Ford has had for many many years, i.e. swapping in a lower mile instrument cluster.

There is no PATS bypass, wouldn't be much of a security system if there was, remote start just uses an "electronic PATS ID tag" for startup, which must be added to PATS system just like any new PATS key would be added.
 
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jbmranger

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I realize this thread is old, however I am currently experiencing a similar problem with my 2004 Explorer 4.0 v6 with PATS.
I replaced a battery and took my time (big mistake, started my problems..). When I had no-start no-crank condition I then thought it was a starter solenoid and replaced that to no avail. Checked and improved grounds under hood, checked fuses, etc. nothing...
Key in on position gets the rapid blinking. Tried the old tilt steering slam, tried the on-off 8 times then keyfob buttons trick. nothing...
Read most everything on the internet I could find, and noticed this to be a common problem. I am told that when the pats system transceiver at the ignition switch where your key goes can fail and commonly does which does not allow the pcm to provide a ground to the starter and fuel injection. I have also been told the pcm prevents ground for the starter and voltage for the fuel injection. I'm not sure which, if either... Wonder what would happen if I were to cut the wires on the pcm that pertain to these... Or perhaps I could jump the relays under the hood?
If someone knows I'd sure be mighty grateful. I have gone broke replacing things already and I'm at my wits end with this pats nonsense. I cannot buy anything else. I must disable this thing to get to work. If someone wants to steal my truck I'd leave the door unlocked for them at this point just to see how they got spark and fuel in spite of that thieving pats that Ford has inflicted upon us.
 

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Umm have you tried testing the ignition tranciever or checking the key or was slamming on the steering wheel the extent of your diagnostic work?

you can't jump relays or cut wires. Its not a carberated pinto. the cumpter controls the fuel system and the PATs system disables fuel delivery at the computer software level. Theres simply no way to run a fuel injected vehicle by bypassing the computer.
 

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I realize this thread is old, however I am currently experiencing a similar problem with my 2004 Explorer 4.0 v6 with PATS.
I replaced a battery and took my time (big mistake, started my problems..). When I had no-start no-crank condition I then thought it was a starter solenoid and replaced that to no avail. Checked and improved grounds under hood, checked fuses, etc. nothing...
Key in on position gets the rapid blinking. Tried the old tilt steering slam, tried the on-off 8 times then keyfob buttons trick. nothing...
Read most everything on the internet I could find, and noticed this to be a common problem. I am told that when the pats system transceiver at the ignition switch where your key goes can fail and commonly does which does not allow the pcm to provide a ground to the starter and fuel injection. I have also been told the pcm prevents ground for the starter and voltage for the fuel injection. I'm not sure which, if either... Wonder what would happen if I were to cut the wires on the pcm that pertain to these... Or perhaps I could jump the relays under the hood?
If someone knows I'd sure be mighty grateful. I have gone broke replacing things already and I'm at my wits end with this pats nonsense. I cannot buy anything else. I must disable this thing to get to work. If someone wants to steal my truck I'd leave the door unlocked for them at this point just to see how they got spark and fuel in spite of that thieving pats that Ford has inflicted upon us.
You tried to fix it yourself, with no knowledge of what you were doing, and none of the proper tools, in what I assume was an attempt to save money.

The diagnostic fees at a garage would have been less than the money you wasted throwing parts at it.

And before you go blaming Ford for the anti-theft system, think about why it is there to begin with. First we had keys to keep people from stealing cars, but thieves learned how to start the car without the key, so they put a lock on the steering wheel. Then the companies put a lock on the steering wheel that couldn't be unlocked without the key. Then the thieves learned how to unlock the steering without the key. So now they had to disable it at the software level to keep people from stealing cars.

Oh, and Ford doesn't care if you car gets stolen or not, and the average customer doesn't care about these devices because its just frustrating when they break. It was the insurance companies that were asking for all these anti-theft devices. If you want to assign some blame, call your car insurance company and complain to them.
 

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@Dirtman - I have 3 Ford keys and a key fob. the key fob buttons all work and operate the locks and the panic alarm. The tilt slam method was from a post on explorerforum.com from people having the same issues. There are others too, I've tried them all.
From a lot of digging it seems that PATS interrupts the ground to both the fuel injection and the starter solenoid. To defeat the PATS I'm wondering if I should attempt to jump the relays or to go straight to the PCM connections. What do you think?

@adsm08 you don't know ... and your hostility doesn't make you seem more clever. you imagine yourself as an attack helicopter? if you knew anything resembling an answer...but no. just a troll. and just because you're a fanboy of ford pats doesn't mean that every time I replace a battery I should have to go to Ford to reset the pats.
 

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@Dirtman - I have 3 Ford keys and a key fob. the key fob buttons all work and operate the locks and the panic alarm. The tilt slam method was from a post on explorerforum.com from people having the same issues. There are others too, I've tried them all.
From a lot of digging it seems that PATS interrupts the ground to both the fuel injection and the starter solenoid. To defeat the PATS I'm wondering if I should attempt to jump the relays or to go straight to the PCM connections. What do you think?

Fobs are a different system. They communicate to the RAP or RKE (name depends on the year) module and only interact with the door locks and panic functions, with are totally separate from PATS.

The "slam" method is often a temporary fix at best, predicated on the idea that there is a loose connection in the PATS antenna that will get closed up by jarring the unit. Otherwise known as "percussive maintenance".

PATs does more than just interrupt grounds to these things. Depending on the year and model it will interrupt the ground or the power through the starter relay if the system doesn't give the PCM the go-ahead, that much you do seem to have correct, and could be easily overridden.

The fuel injector shut down cannot be physically overridden.
The injectors are all powered off a common bus, so all 6 take their power from one key on source that is not tied into the PATS system. The PCM times the firing and controls the duration of the injector pulse by grounding each injector individually and directly. This function is shut down AT THE SOFTWARE LEVEL when PATS has not enabled engine starting. At best an attempt to wire around this by taking the PCM out of the picture will result in the injectors fully open all the time, which is the EFI equivalent of your float sticking open on a carb, and will flood the engine quite quickly. Since injector pulse are timed in milliseconds, good luck trying to do it manually.


@adsm08 you don't know ... and your hostility doesn't make you seem more clever.
Not hostile, accurate. If you had the tools you would have told us codes. If you had the knowledge you would have figured out that PATS was giving you issues before replacing the starter solenoid. I've worked and taught in the auto industry for nearly 15 years now. I can identify someone who is actually capable of diagnosing a problem, if given the right info pretty quickly. I can also identify quickly when someone lacks the requisite skills and tools.



you imagine yourself as an attack helicopter?
That line is a dig at the current PCBS climate of "I can identify as anything I want to and you can't tell me I'm not really that thing". It has at most no bearing whatsoever on this current interaction or my day to day interactions with other. If you genuinely want to be concerned about a line in my signature, worry about the quote from Randall Munroe, because that one is actually true.

if you knew anything resembling an answer...but no.
Get me codes, then I'll have something resembling an answer.

just a troll. and just because you're a fanboy of ford pats doesn't mean that every time I replace a battery I should have to go to Ford to reset the pats.
I have replaced probably a couple hundred batteries over ten years or working at Ford dealerships and three other years of working at parts stores, and have had approximately less than one vehicle that would not start when I was done due to needing the PATS system reset. I have also done quite a few other large jobs, engine replacements, transmission overhauls, etc, that had the battery unhooked for weeks or months while waiting for parts. None of them needed the PATS system reset either. Key IDs are not stored in the keep alive memory, and are not going to be wiped just because the battery was unhooked, no matter how long it was unhooked for.

You have another issue with the system. It may have been a weak component that failed due to the minor jolt to the electrical system caused by connecting/disconnecting the battery, or another issue that just happened to crop up at the same time. But a flashing light means codes. We can't point you in a specific direction without them.

Also, I'm not a big fan of PATS either. I specifically own vehicles that were built before it was common so that I can avoid it. What I am a fan of is placing blame where it actually belongs, and Ford (or any other auto manufacturer) didn't run out and engineer this system because they were bored, the insurance companies have been pressuring the auto makers for anti-theft devices on the cars since the 50s. It started with ignition locks, and moved to steering locks, and eventually PATS systems.
 
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Dirtman

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If someone with no training or specific tools could bypass an anti theft system by slamming on the steering wheel, hacking off some wires, or reading random internet "research" it would be a pointless security system. Take all the parts you didn't need back to the store and spend your money paying a professional. You do not have the skills necessary to do the repair and you are taking your frustration out on people giving you the only good advice you're going to find by googling...
 

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