Raptor vs Lightning

I know a lot of ya'll are off-roading, 4x4 driving, deer hunting, ruralites, BUT I'm not. I think the Raptor is a kool looking truck with the wide fenders and all, but I miss the Lightning. When I was younger, Ford released the "NITE" F-150, ( some body in my town has transformed a full size Bronco into a "NITE") the predecessor to the Lightning. A fast 2wd street truck. Then came the Lightning, man what a baddass truck. Then right when chevy got in the street truck game with the Silverado SS, Ford goes and stops production on the SVT Lightning. ( WHY? ) After a few years of nothing , they released the RAPTOR. Like I said, Kool truck, but what about the street guys that don't want or need an Off-Roader. Is it possible for SVT to have more than one vehicle at a time. I know you can get a Rousch or Saleen version of an F150, but that is not "SVT" and is basically a tuner division for Ford, like AMG is for Mercedes. would it be too difficult to make a 2wd street version of the Raptor, and I don't know call it Raptor Roadster or something?

Sure it is. Every truck is 2WD until you engage the 4x4 system. So, just leave 4x4 turned off, and you're all good.

They won't build them both at the same time because the are built for the exact same purpose. Something my auto tech professor liked to refer to as "Automotive masturbation".

It mostly involves paying $10K over sticker for a vehicle that is not worth it, and then adding lots of stick-on chrome.

1990RangerinSK said:

Sure it is. Every truck is 2WD until you engage the 4x4 system. So, just leave 4x4 turned off, and you're all good.

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4wd gear weighs it down, shit breaks, high center of gravity, that annoying roar those tire make, nah, not the same Bro.


They won't build them both at the same time because the are built for the exact same purpose - Quote from adsm08

How is Off-Roading and "street racing" the same purpose? to me they are polar opposites, besides speed there is no other correlation.

My $0.02: money.

If there was an SVT Ranger and a Raptor Ranger, it would compete with each other for sales. This was part of the demise of the Ranger when it stopped production in 2012; it competed too much with the full-size F-150. Ford thought that Ford sales & profit numbers would increase with the bigger brother and production costs for a separate model would free up some assets. This wasn't the case; people went to other manufacturers or went with alternative Ford products.

The other reason is demand. Most normal people will not pay a premium for a mini truck like the Ranger. It simply isn't everyone's cup of tea. Sure, it'll sell, but it won't rocket it ahead of competitors. There have been sport versions of mini trucks or mini SUV's in the past with all auto manufacturers; they all were not "OMG, he's drives a Typhoon" scale.

Just because you CAN doesn't mean you SHOULD. Sure, Ford Engineers can stick an old Coyote or a Voodoo into a truck, but that is a lot of man hours and money to invest. It won't add up.

Lastly, safety. Mustang owners are already having a hard time avoiding car show pedestrians on the sidewalk. Doing something like that will tarnish the reputation even more, especially since it'll be in a lighter, less rigid platform with substantially less weight in the back.

Note: To those that say "trucks have frames. They are rigid." Of course they are, but they will never transfer weight to the FR layout as readily as a more triangulated and properly weighted setup.



-Pete

Ok I am going to help Ranger850 out here since everyone else seems confused by the post and are responding with answers that are not really related to what he is talking about. Ranger850 wants to see a new full size standard cab, possibly extended cab (not a 4 door), with a lot of horsepower and torque and nice sleek designs, more like a race truck than a regular truck, you know kind of like they did on the old Lightnings. I think Ford needs to step up their game by a lot since Chevy has done way more options, mods, and styling. The issue is money. Why spend 40-50k on a brand new "Lightning" (if they made it, that is) when you can spend that same amount of money on something that is just as capable and then some? You could just buy a raptor and put street tires on it and still have MORE hp and torque as what the last Lightning had. OR, buy a nice new standard cab truck and put 10 grand in it and make your own bad ass Lightning. Ford has definitely dropped the ball on a lot of things and this is one of them. Chevys line up compared to Fords line up is a joke on ford. Especially when ford is only going to make mustangs and a few focus models in the years to come. Not much of an option when chevy has a spark, sonic, cruz, volt, impala, Malibu, Camaro, trax, equinox, traverse, Colorado, silverado, tahoe, suburban and corvette...... where as ford has, mustang, focus, f150, 250, 350, ranger, explorer, expedition, eco sport, wha wha wha..... Not much to pick from unless you have an SUV.

Ranger850 said:

How is Off-Roading and "street racing" the same purpose? to me they are polar opposites, besides speed there is no other correlation.

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Same purpose as they are mainly status symbol vehicles.

There is no desert racing to be had in southwest Iowa. I don't even think the state has an off road park. Yet spotless Raptors everywhere...

Ford did a kinda sorta attempt with the Tremors. They got too greedy on the pricing and they kinda did a faceplant.

3.5EB in a std cab shortbox truck with 4.10 gears and loaded FX4 trim. Even has rear A/C (yes in a standard cab truck ) 4wd was optional.

91stranger said:

Ok I am going to help Ranger850 out here since everyone else seems confused by the post and are responding with answers that are not really related to what he is talking about. Ranger850 wants to see a new full size standard cab, possibly extended cab (not a 4 door), with a lot of horsepower and torque and nice sleek designs, more like a race truck than a regular truck, you know kind of like they did on the old Lightnings. I think Ford needs to step up their game by a lot since Chevy has done way more options, mods, and styling. The issue is money. Why spend 40-50k on a brand new "Lightning" (if they made it, that is) when you can spend that same amount of money on something that is just as capable and then some? You could just buy a raptor and put street tires on it and still have MORE hp and torque as what the last Lightning had. OR, buy a nice new standard cab truck and put 10 grand in it and make your own bad ass Lightning. Ford has definitely dropped the ball on a lot of things and this is one of them. Chevys line up compared to Fords line up is a joke on ford. Especially when ford is only going to make mustangs and a few focus models in the years to come. Not much of an option when chevy has a spark, sonic, cruz, volt, impala, Malibu, Camaro, trax, equinox, traverse, Colorado, silverado, tahoe, suburban and corvette...... where as ford has, mustang, focus, f150, 250, 350, ranger, explorer, expedition, eco sport, wha wha wha..... Not much to pick from unless you have an SUV.

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yes YOU get it.
Also Limited Production numbers make a vehicle MORE saleable, so limit Raptors for some Lightning, then calculate " SVT" sales and there is no competeing with self. And if you ad 10k worth of goodies to your truck, you lose warranties and all that, if it has an "SVT" and everything is done at the factory, warranty should hold up to most claims. with in reason of course

Ranger850 said:

Then right when chevy got in the street truck game with the Silverado SS, Ford goes and stops production on the SVT Lightning. ( WHY? )

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I had an 04 Lightning and the reason some of the guys on the SVT forum were told it was because Ford went to the new model of F-150....new frame, heavier, etc....the 03 and 04 L's were built on the old "Heritage" frame/body. It seemed like a cop-out then, and still does. IF Ford would have built the lower end of the Lightning motor like it now makes the 2.3 EB (forged crank and con rods), it would have been waaaay better, as this was it's weakest link. I knew a few guys that dropped a Kenne Bell supercharger and turned the boost up, ended up busting and rebuilding the lower end....not cheap to do.

I hope Ford has fixed the issue the Focus RS and Mustang had with breaking the block. It's a simple design flaw with the block casting and a lack of proper reinforcement.....we shall see

Ranger850 said:

yes YOU get it.
Also Limited Production numbers make a vehicle MORE saleable, so limit Raptors for some Lightning, then calculate " SVT" sales and there is no competeing with self. And if you ad 10k worth of goodies to your truck, you lose warranties and all that, if it has an "SVT" and everything is done at the factory, warranty should hold up to most claims. with in reason of course

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Both Shelby and Roush build hopped up F-150's and most dealers can sell Shelby, quite a few can do Roush too.

Ranger850 said:

yes YOU get it.
Also Limited Production numbers make a vehicle MORE saleable, so limit Raptors for some Lightning, then calculate " SVT" sales and there is no competeing with self. And if you ad 10k worth of goodies to your truck, you lose warranties and all that, if it has an "SVT" and everything is done at the factory, warranty should hold up to most claims. with in reason of course

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I see.

Something is only worth what people are willing to sell it for.

With a limited production of something, it needs to be stellar. You can't add new ground effects, a leather interior, and Bluetooth and upcharge. It's gotta be special.

Again, it takes a lot of effort to make something like this happen. Sure, it would hold value, but is it worth the money for Ford to made a special edition F-150? Not really. It's not a priority.

The last post was referencing Rangers, but it still applies to different models of other vehicles. A Fiesta can play in World Rallies and sponsorship and publicity and championships, and the same can be said for high horsepower Mustangs.

But, a fast F-150 for the Baja 500 or the Dakar? Not at the top of Ford's "To Do" list.

https://www.beechmontford.com/725-horsepower-f-150--37-995.htm


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AgPete139 said:

I see.

Something is only worth what people are willing to sell it for.

With a limited production of something, it needs to be stellar. You can't add new ground effects, a leather interior, and Bluetooth and upcharge. It's gotta be special..

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I think the Lightning and the Raptor was a little more than leather and Bluetooth. They were and are special trucks. I'm Just saying we didn't even know we wanted a RAPTOR until they gave it to us. Now everybody wants there truck to look like a raptor, with the tall tires and beadlock wheels , sometimes on a 2wd.

https://www.beechmontford.com/725-horsepower-f-150--37-995.htm

Why don't Ford do this. Hell I'm adding this truck to my Christmas list.

You don't think Ford knew there was a market for the Raptor before they developed it?

fastpakr said:

You don't think Ford knew there was a market for the Raptor before they developed it?

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They didn't know there was a market for the mustang, they passed on it, Chevy did not and got the Camaro first.

From what one of these post say, the new 150 framwas wrong for the lightning, so I think they just designed a different truck around a different frame, and then introduced it to the market. Pre-Raptor, there were not a lot of desert runners on the street. Toyato and Nissan had the PRe-Runners, but they were not as capable as a real desert truck, and I think the Pre-Runners were dressed up 2wd to look like 4wd.
EDIT : Why would they desert a market that they already established i.e. Lightning