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good blocks?


jaymegriffiths

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could someone please post what models are good donors for building power out of a 302? id like to start building my 302 but i dont have a block and id like to try and find a solid foundation. im talking 350-400 horse at the crank, all i need is more power than my friends .060 over 429 in his 49 dodge. ok maybe thats askin a lot but a fast engine nonetheless.
perhaps there could be a sticky on this cause i've looked to no availe numerous times.
please explain to me what i need to ask for at the wreckers!
THANKS
 


baddad457

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Look for a D8VE casting in a flat tappet block, or any of the 86-2001 roller blocks for a roller cam.
 

jaymegriffiths

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Look for a D8VE casting in a flat tappet block, or any of the 86-2001 roller blocks for a roller cam.
ok heres my problem. i dont know what that means.
is there a specific model?
ie years of cars or trucks or vans and ill go from there. also how to identify them. do i need to pull intakes or valve covers off or somthing?
i've read so much on 302s its retarded and im still very fresh
i clicked the link and read that the castings are on the right above the starter. ok so i want a roller cam engine so i don not want a d8ve block correct?
and a roller cam can be identified or found in what cars?
how will i know?
 
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Angie

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no idea if you read all that page i linked to or not... however, here is the main bits i was getting at on the articles bottom....


The 302 block was virtually unchanged through 1975. In your search for a 302 block, we suggest the use of the high nickel content blocks produced from mid-1967 through the early 1970s. One alternative, though not always easy to find, are the 302 blocks cast in Mexico. A number of these blocks found their way into U.S.-built Fords and Mercurys. These Mexican blocks weigh more, but they offer strength in a heavier casting, thus being more suitable for high-performance use.


do a google search for information about the mexican block. I take it you are building old school power... carbbed?

one way to know if it is a mexico block is that it is casted right into the top of the block under the intake.
 
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baddad457

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ok heres my problem. i dont know what that means.
is there a specific model?
ie years of cars or trucks or vans and ill go from there. also how to identify them. do i need to pull intakes or valve covers off or somthing?
i've read so much on 302s its retarded and im still very fresh
i clicked the link and read that the castings are on the right above the starter. ok so i want a roller cam engine so i don not want a d8ve block correct?
and a roller cam can be identified or found in what cars?
how will i know?
D8VE is the casting prefix, found just above the starter. The roller blocks were used for all 5.0's in all applications beginning in 1986. These blocks have 4 more pounds of iron added over the 85 5.0 HO roller blocks. Now, although all applications used a roller block from 86-on, the pickups and vans had flat tappet cams in these blocks until the end of the 91 model year. Thereafter, all applications had roller cams. The easiest way to Id a roller cammed 5.0 is to pull one pushrod out and measure it. They measure 6.25" long. Flat tappet pushrods for 5.0's are a half inch longer. (give or take a few thousandths) If you're going to use the stock heads & cam, then you may want to limit your search to the 94-97 Pickup/van 5.0's. These motors are more plentiful than the Mustang HO version and the only difference is the camshaft. The 94-97 pickup/van cam is only slightly less cam on the intake side in comparison to the HO cam. The full size Ford/Lincoln/Merc 5.0's had different heads, cams and pistons and were rated a full 50-75 HP less than the others.
 

jaymegriffiths

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D8VE is the casting prefix, found just above the starter. The roller blocks were used for all 5.0's in all applications beginning in 1986. These blocks have 4 more pounds of iron added over the 85 5.0 HO roller blocks. Now, although all applications used a roller block from 86-on, the pickups and vans had flat tappet cams in these blocks until the end of the 91 model year. Thereafter, all applications had roller cams. The easiest way to Id a roller cammed 5.0 is to pull one pushrod out and measure it. They measure 6.25" long. Flat tappet pushrods for 5.0's are a half inch longer. (give or take a few thousandths) If you're going to use the stock heads & cam, then you may want to limit your search to the 94-97 Pickup/van 5.0's. These motors are more plentiful than the Mustang HO version and the only difference is the camshaft. The 94-97 pickup/van cam is only slightly less cam on the intake side in comparison to the HO cam. The full size Ford/Lincoln/Merc 5.0's had different heads, cams and pistons and were rated a full 50-75 HP less than the others.
plan is to buy new afr 165's
and is there no reprocussion swap wise to putting a carb on a 5.0 fi engine?
(just swap heads, intake, +add carb)?
and theres lots of licoln and mercury and ford cars (non stang) available dirt cheap is heads the sole cause of the lower power?
ie if im rebuilding ground up will a 86+car block be ideal?

if so i should have no prob finding one. next prob. is an aod going to survive a 350+hp 302 or should i look more into t5's or a 4r55(?) or whatever tranny an option.(can they be converted to run without efi or are they e shift only)
oh and i did read some of the link but if i skipped some my apologies.
but when people tell me find a roller block and mexican blocks ar 67-70 im gonna trust the roller block as i know they make more reliable better road mannered power
or so im told.
anyways thanks an like i said is 86+good if im replacing cam+heads anyways?
 

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Baddad just curios... will that block you are talking about take 289 internals?

Jay.... are you going to be using injectors or carb? and how deep are your pockets for this build? I am getting the feeling that you are wanting major power on the cheap. here is another intersting read about HIPO 302.

Remember that the older blocks used to be hiped up with 289 internals and that made a shade tree stroker. the mexican blocks will take an over bore easier than regular 302 blocks due to the fact that the walls are thincker and give the block that much more leeway.

"The two most popular methods for increasing the displacement of the late model Mustang is a stroked 302, usually displacing somewhere between 321 and 347 cubes or a 351W conversion. The purpose of this installment of the Water Box is to examine both options and offer some insight into which is the better choice for the average enthusiast.

Increasing the stroke of the stock 302 can yield substantial performance increases without affecting overall driveability or the car's current manners. Since it's visually impossible to tell that your 302 may actually be a 347, the extra stroke offers an element of surprise to unsuspecting competitors.

While stroking a 302 has many benefits, it also has some shortcomings. Perhaps the most important point to consider is that the late model 302 block is structurally weak and prone to substantial flexing. In mild applications, block strength is not as important a concern as it is with higher horsepower levels (425 or more). To build a high horsepower stroked 302 that will not suffer constant head gasket failure and the threat of coming apart, a Motorsport A4 block is a must. The A4 block is the end all for head gasket problems and can safely channel 1000+ horsepower, it's the kind of block that engine builders dream about. The problem is cost. Add $500 - $750 in machining to the $1600 price tag of the bare block and it quickly becomes cost prohibitive for the average enthusiast. A stroked 302 can be reliable using a Mexican 302 block (which is much stronger than late model 302 blocks) but they're becoming more and more difficult find."


hope this helps
 

bcost882

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347 stroker... hahaha
 

Angie

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347 stroker... hahaha

whats so funny?
 

bcost882

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nothing that is a good hahaha it is i want to caress it as it is installed and tested. the 347 is so undersold it makes me sick. the 302 can compare to the chevy 350 so easily it is embarassing to chevy ahaha. put some cometic gaskets in there and you are straight on
 
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Angie

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nothing wrong with a good 302...

My girlfriend & I know of a drag car that runs a 289 and blows away all BB cheBBies in the class... these chev guys are like WTF.... LOL

my saying is anyone can build a 350... but it takes a man to build a ford... :)
 

bcost882

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do research on the heads you have, cause there are the gt or gt-40. and the cams are relatively easy then porting and such. if you do research on it you can find massive articles. you will be amazed
 

baddad457

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plan is to buy new afr 165's
and is there no reprocussion swap wise to putting a carb on a 5.0 fi engine?
(just swap heads, intake, +add carb)? CORRECT, THAT'S ALL THAT'S NEEDED, OTHER THAN A STEEL GEARED DISTRIBUTOR TO MATCH THE ROLLER CAM, THE TFJ DISTRIBUTOR THESE ENGINES CAME WITH WON'T WORK WITHOUT THE COMPUTER
and theres lots of licoln and mercury and ford cars (non stang) available dirt cheap is heads the sole cause of the lower power?
ie if im rebuilding ground up will a 86+car block be ideal?
ALSO CORRECT
if so i should have no prob finding one. next prob. is an aod going to survive a 350+hp 302 or should i look more into t5's or a 4r55(?) or whatever tranny an option.(can they be converted to run without efi or are they e shift only) THE AOD CAN BE BUILT TO HANDLE WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO. THE 4R70W NEEDS A COMPUTER TO FUNCTION, AS DIES AN AODE
oh and i did read some of the link but if i skipped some my apologies.
but when people tell me find a roller block and mexican blocks ar 67-70 im gonna trust the roller block as i know they make more reliable better road mannered power
or so im told.
anyways thanks an like i said is 86+good if im replacing cam+heads anyways?
The Mex blocks are over rated. The reason they're thicker was because of the inferior casting techniques used in Ford's Mexican casting foundry. The D8VE blocks are just as heavy, but the casting quality is better. Only difference is they had the std main cap. But those aren't known for failures anyway. A main girdle will help there, and should be used anyway for a stroker.
 

jaymegriffiths

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Baddad just curios... will that block you are talking about take 289 internals?

Jay.... are you going to be using injectors or carb? and how deep are your pockets for this build? I am getting the feeling that you are wanting major power on the cheap. here is another intersting read about HIPO 302.

Remember that the older blocks used to be hiped up with 289 internals and that made a shade tree stroker. the mexican blocks will take an over bore easier than regular 302 blocks due to the fact that the walls are thincker and give the block that much more leeway.

"The two most popular methods for increasing the displacement of the late model Mustang is a stroked 302, usually displacing somewhere between 321 and 347 cubes or a 351W conversion. The purpose of this installment of the Water Box is to examine both options and offer some insight into which is the better choice for the average enthusiast.

Increasing the stroke of the stock 302 can yield substantial performance increases without affecting overall driveability or the car's current manners. Since it's visually impossible to tell that your 302 may actually be a 347, the extra stroke offers an element of surprise to unsuspecting competitors.

While stroking a 302 has many benefits, it also has some shortcomings. Perhaps the most important point to consider is that the late model 302 block is structurally weak and prone to substantial flexing. In mild applications, block strength is not as important a concern as it is with higher horsepower levels (425 or more). To build a high horsepower stroked 302 that will not suffer constant head gasket failure and the threat of coming apart, a Motorsport A4 block is a must. The A4 block is the end all for head gasket problems and can safely channel 1000+ horsepower, it's the kind of block that engine builders dream about. The problem is cost. Add $500 - $750 in machining to the $1600 price tag of the bare block and it quickly becomes cost prohibitive for the average enthusiast. A stroked 302 can be reliable using a Mexican 302 block (which is much stronger than late model 302 blocks) but they're becoming more and more difficult find."


hope this helps
my whole goal is to build a well mannered mild 302 that isn't going to break every time i spin it to 6 grand. am i going to be taking it to the track once a week? no. am i going to be baggin the crap outta it? no. do i like being able to take fast cars on main street? yes. point is i've always wanted to do a 302 swap and my rangers engine is lacking.
if i spend 5 grand or more making this truck into my dream truck i dont see any waste whatsoever.
the reason im not building a 347 is i've heard the stroke is too long and the pistons travel too far down, eventually resulting in chatter in the cylinder. i've read that the 331 stroker kit solved these problems. i dont think i will be going that far as i dont need 500 horsepower. 350 or 375 is plenty, and 300 at the wheels is more than enough to give me great passing power.
i wont be starting to build an engine until i've bought a new truck to dd (most likely going to buy an 06+ranger 4x4 4 liter)
i've been saving for a downpayment for about 2 months and i have just over 2000
next month my pay will be small as im going to hawaii so after that its all workin and buying ranger parts.
thanks for all your help dude its awesome.

nothing wrong with a good 302...

My girlfriend & I know of a drag car that runs a 289 and blows away all BB cheBBies in the class... these chev guys are like WTF.... LOL

my saying is anyone can build a 350... but it takes a man to build a ford... :)
your awesome. takes a man to build a ford hahahaha. now every time i hear that song im gonna think they should change the words hahaha:icon_rofl:
do research on the heads you have, cause there are the gt or gt-40. and the cams are relatively easy then porting and such. if you do research on it you can find massive articles. you will be amazed
i dont have en engine, hence the reason im lookin for a starting point. its just theres so much confusion.


The Mex blocks are over rated. The reason they're thicker was because of the inferior casting techniques used in Ford's Mexican casting foundry. The D8VE blocks are just as heavy, but the casting quality is better. Only difference is they had the std main cap. But those aren't known for failures anyway. A main girdle will help there, and should be used anyway for a stroker.
plus if i went to a mexican block i would sacrifice a roller cam and rockers. im confident roller cam will give me better driving manners and a smoother idle, both important in maintaining a good sleeper.
thank you for your answers, and one more question. or two. hehe
how do i identify the correct dizzy?
just pull em out til i find one with steel gears?
what other types of gears might there be, aluminum? or like cast or something?
hope im not sounding stupid here.
one more thing, is building a AOD a good direction to go?
or should i look more into tremec or t5's?
what good autos are there with a good overdrive?
i'd like some highway milage...
 

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