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Vibration at 3000+ RPM ???


97Ranger3.0

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Hey guys, I'm looking for some help and this is a strange one...

Recently I did a bit of work to the cooling system on my 1997 Ford Ranger 3.0 XL, and after the work I now have a vibration/shudder/rumble that occurs at 3k rpm and up. What's weird about it is that prior to doing this work, I didn't have this problem and I didn't do any work to the driveline so I don't understand where this vibration is coming from.

Here's a list of what I did in the process & some of my possible theories (for what it's worth):
-New radiator & water pump (required removing ac compressor/power steering bracket, idler pulley and belt tensioner)
-Cleaned the belt tensioner and idler pulley with a wire wheel (both had gunk on them that I assume was bits of the old serpentine belt that rubbed off)

After finishing this work, one thing I noticed immediately was some belt squeal. I recently replaced my serpentine belt with a good quality one (like maybe 3k miles ago) and it never squealed until now. When I took the truck for a test drive, the squealing didn't go away and I noticed that when I hit 3000 RPM suddenly I felt this distinct vibration. It's very hard to explain but it's like a very rumbly shudder, you feel it in your seat. The tone of the engine changes too, it gets more rumbly as well. It happens pretty much right at 3000 RPM and continues until redline. No check engine lights, no power loss that I can tell, nothing really seems off except that vibration. :icon_confused:

My initial theory was that maybe the belt started to slip at around 3k and that caused a noticeable vibration but that doesn't really make sense. And I was able to adjust the belt a little bit and quiet the squealing down a tad, but the vibration is still there. Or maybe when I cleaned the idler and tensioner pulley's I caused them to be out of true?

So then I started looking around and I noticed a couple of things. One thing is that my power steering pulley has some slop in it and can be pushed in and out, which is probably what's causing the belt squeal. Is it possible if that has enough play, that could cause a noticeable vibration? I have my doubts about that but you never know.

The other thing I noticed is that the fan clutch seems to have excessive play. It can be rotated all around in a way I imagine it's not supposed to, plus when the engine's running you can see some slight movement of the fan back and forth. So my other thought is, could that movement (probably a bad bearing or something in the fan clutch?) be enough to cause a noticeable vibration? :dunno:

This is probably the weirdest thing I've ever experienced, and would love to hear some theories as to what this could be.
 


91stranger

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Is there any shaking in the steering wheel or any pull from left to right when this happens? Are you able to jack up the truck all the way off the ground and get the rpm's above 3000 and see what is causing this? This would be a safe way to look at the motor and at speed and rpm without being 30-40 mph down the highway. Or if you have a friend who can put the motor in drive and give it gas while you watch the motor. If things have as much play as you say they do then I would start there. I would also check you plugs as well and make sure the wires are on good. I had a mustang that would do something similar and it was because a plug was loose and the wire was slightly popped off. Somehow that wire popped off all the time and I found the plug came in-threaded as well.
 

97Ranger3.0

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Is there any shaking in the steering wheel or any pull from left to right when this happens? Are you able to jack up the truck all the way off the ground and get the rpm's above 3000 and see what is causing this? This would be a safe way to look at the motor and at speed and rpm without being 30-40 mph down the highway. Or if you have a friend who can put the motor in drive and give it gas while you watch the motor. If things have as much play as you say they do then I would start there. I would also check you plugs as well and make sure the wires are on good. I had a mustang that would do something similar and it was because a plug was loose and the wire was slightly popped off. Somehow that wire popped off all the time and I found the plug came in-threaded as well.
There's no pull left to right or steering wheel shake, and I've had the tires rebalanced and a front end alignment done recently too. This truck's always had a slight shudder similar to this but way more subtle since I bought it. So I had those things done to see if it would get better but it hasn't, and now it's worse and I'm wondering if this accentuated shudder above 3k rpm is related to the mild shudder reminiscent of tires out of balance I've felt before.

I did check the plug wires at least, because I had that same thought too. None of them came loose off the plugs themselves, but I didn't check the plugs themselves. I could check that as well. I did have my brother look at the engine with the truck on the ground in neutral revving to 3k + to see if anything looked whack, but we didn't see anything aside from the fan wobbling slightly (I think I have a bad bearing in my fan clutch because it has play) and the serpentine belt seemed to move slightly. I do have play in the power steering pulley but I believe that's the only pulley with slop. Also, when in neutral revving up I didn't seem to notice the vibration, so I'm wondering if it only happens under load.

I do like the idea of having it jacked up and in gear though, I might give that a try and see if I can replicate it that way.

My other thought is, is it possible my harmonic balancer is going? It seems like some of my symptoms line up with that possibly.
 

RonD

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Fan clutch can certainly cause a higher RPM vibration, had it once, chased my tail a bit but that was the cause, it worked OK no rise in temp when idling, but did cause vibration on my 4.0l when above 2,800rpm if memory serves

Also had a bad tire that balanced OK but when weight was applied the separated band cause vibration at higher speed but definitely speed related not RPM related
 
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97Ranger3.0

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Fan clutch can certainly cause a higher RPM vibration, had it once, chased my tail a bit but that was the cause, it worked OK no rise in temp when idling, but did cause vibration on my 4.0l when above 2,800rpm if memory serves

Also had a bad tire that balanced OK but when weight was applied the separated band cause vibration at higher speed but definitely speed related not RPM related
Well, speaking of, I just replaced my fan clutch this morning and didn't have any luck. The vibration is still there just the same. Like I said I don't think it's the tires because they were balanced before I had done this work and this vibration wasn't there until I did this work.

Any more thoughts/suggestions? I'm getting frustrated because this really doesn't even make sense, also I've now got a new coolant leak in a different spot that's worse than I started with. Gotta love fixing something and just ending up with it worse :pissedoff:
 

97Ranger3.0

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Actually, I've driven the truck a little more today and the vibration is a little better after changing the fan clutch. It now kicks in a little higher, toward 3500 RPM is when it's noticeable and it's noticeably a little gentler. But, the vibration is still there.

I was doing some reading about similar problems people have had on other cars, and one person suggested running it for a short period of time (30-45 seconds) without the serpentine belt on to see if it still does the same thing, and doing this could eliminate if it's something that is being driven by the belt. I think I will try this tomorrow and see what happens. If it goes away, I figure it's a safe bet to replace the power steering pump or pulley, whichever one is causing the pulley to have play and see if that then fixes it. If it doesn't go away then I can probably assume it's an engine or driveline issue.
 

RonD

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Yes, you can run COLD engine without fan belt

First, before shutting engine off where it will sit to cool off, document where you feel the vibration when REVing engine, at what RPMs.
Then after it is COLD loosen and remove fan belt from Crank pulley(drive pulley)
Start engine and test
You can run COLD engine for about 2min max without water pump circulating coolant
Not sure I would "drive" the vehicle like that.
Engine under load doubles heat up, and if its RPM related then driving it won't help.
 

97Ranger3.0

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4"
Tire Size
33x12.5
Yes, you can run COLD engine without fan belt

First, before shutting engine off where it will sit to cool off, document where you feel the vibration when REVing engine, at what RPMs.
Then after it is COLD loosen and remove fan belt from Crank pulley(drive pulley)
Start engine and test
You can run COLD engine for about 2min max without water pump circulating coolant
Not sure I would "drive" the vehicle like that.
Engine under load doubles heat up, and if its RPM related then driving it won't help.
True, but I wasn't planning on going far to drive it. I have a long driveway so I was literally planning on going up and down my driveway once with the belt off to see if I felt the vibration. But maybe I will just try rev's. I'm hoping to try this tomorrow before tearing the truck down again to fix another coolant leak that has presented itself. I'll let you guys know what happens with the test.
 

evanesce69

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Does it make the vibration while in park or neutral with the engine revved?

Or is the vibration only while driving?

I don't like revving the engine on jackstands with the tires moving, too much can go wrong. At the very least remove the tires and reinstall a couple lugnuts to keep the drums from flying off or better yet remove the driveshaft at the transmission/transfer case flange.
 

97Ranger3.0

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4"
Tire Size
33x12.5
Does it make the vibration while in park or neutral with the engine revved?

Or is the vibration only while driving?

I don't like revving the engine on jackstands with the tires moving, too much can go wrong. At the very least remove the tires and reinstall a couple lugnuts to keep the drums from flying off or better yet remove the driveshaft at the transmission/transfer case flange.
Yes it did vibrate when sitting in neutral and revving, although it was more noticeable when driving which I'm guessing is just because of the additional load.

I was able to isolate the problem though! I did the serpentine belt test (removing it and running the engine for a short time) and found that the vibration was gone. So I ran some more simple tests, and found that with the serpentine belt on, but the fan and fan clutch assembly gone, again there were no vibrations. It makes perfect sense because I replaced the fan clutch and it got a little better but apparently my fan wasn't any good anymore either. After replacing the fan as well, the vibration is gone.

I hope this helps people, maybe someone out there will have this problem as well. I've never experienced this before, but I can't be the only person this has happened to.
 

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