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How do Hydrogen cells work?


stevenf

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The electric current goes through the water and causes hyrdogen bubbles to form. These hydrogen bubbles are transferred through a tube into the air intake tube of the vehicle. This gas gives for an easier ignite in the chamber thus using less gasolene?
Am I anywhere close?
 


lifted4.0

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well all your gonna hear is that it doesnt work, just warning you
 

stevenf

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ok, If it did work..... Is that how it is being described as working? Or is it suposed to replace all of the fuel? does it make better gas milage or is it outragious 100mpg crap?
For thoughs that believe, how does it work?
For thoughs that dont believe, why does it not work?
 

MAKG

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TrexMex, you're describing a hydrogen fuel cell, a sort of battery. The hydrogen is NOT burned in an internal combustion engine.

The question is about the latest bit of fuel-saving scam. And the "how would it work" question is more than a bit stunning. "If the sky were green, why would it be so?" Umm, the sky ISN'T green.

The HHO crap described here depends upon violating energy conservation. It's impossible to generate hydrogen on-board the vehicle and burn it for any gain.
 

superdave1984

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ok, If it did work..... Is that how it is being described as working? Or is it suposed to replace all of the fuel? does it make better gas milage or is it outragious 100mpg crap?
For thoughs that believe, how does it work?
For thoughs that dont believe, why does it not work?
If it does work the hydrogen is burned along with the gasoline supposedly giving you MPG improvements of (claimed) up to 50% or more. I can only theorize why it supposedly works in that maybe the hydrogen allows for a more complete burn of the gasoline. I'm skeptically curious and we have yet to install the one we built. It does create a good deal of hydrogen using about 8-10 amps of current. The main concern (for me)is that the water gets pretty hot. About 140-150 degrees. So far the thing is good for filling water bottles and milk jugs then blowing them up. The neighbors are pissed about it however.
 

MAKG

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Superdave, if you're not burning 1/3 of the gasoline going into the engine, don't you think an exhaust sniffer would be able to detect that? Typical unburned HC sniffs are in the hundreds of PPM, not anywhere near the 300,000 your statement would require. Even before cats, a burn THAT bad would fill the combustion chamber with carbon (if it ran at all), instantly fuel foul the crankcase, and pump liquid fuel out the exhaust pipe at a rate of a gallon per hour or so at highway speed. You would be able to SEE that.
 

superdave1984

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I said maybe.
 

stevenf

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So if its impossible to create enough onboard the car. Couldnt you create it, tank it, then plug-n-go?
 

rboyer

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That would be fine and dandy but i'd rather be floating in a pool of gasoline with a lit cigarette in my hand before I got in a car with a tank full of hydrogen strapped to the back of it.
 

MAKG

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So if its impossible to create enough onboard the car. Couldnt you create it, tank it, then plug-n-go?
In principle, yes, but the safety ramifications are significant.

You're also going to need a lot more of it than you think. Hydrogen has about 3 times the energy BY WEIGHT than gasoline. That means 300 miles will require more than 50 lbs of hydrogen. So, now you need some infrastructure to compress the hell out of it, and it's no longer a DIY job (badly designed compressor systems for flammable gasses = bombs).
 
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hades

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These hydrogen cells are really intriguing. I also wonder how they work. And until now I still do...

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AllanD

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In principle, yes, but the safety ramifications are significant.

You're also going to need a lot more of it than you think. Hydrogen has about 3 times the energy BY WEIGHT than gasoline. That means 300 miles will require more than 50 lbs of hydrogen. So, now you need some infrastructure to compress the hell out of it, and it's no longer a DIY job (badly designed compressor systems for flammable gasses = bombs).
MAKG,

you failed only by not completing the thought....

Yes Hydrogen is more energetic BY WEIGHT. the issue is
that it takes something like six times the VOLUME to carry
an equivelent energy even presuming you are dealing with
(cryogenic) LIQUID Hydrogen

so using my own truck with a SINGLE 20gallon tank
(people who know my truck may now activate their
trans-nasal bovine mammory excretion propulsion system)
my truck can go 400 miles on that single tank.

To go the same distance on hydrogen requires a frigging
giganormous fuel tank.

But it gets worse, if you are presuming gaseous hydrogen (even highly compressed) you simply can't carry enough to matter (as determined by being able to drive any "Serious" distance.)

Frankly all the talk about fuel cells is as an end-around to the limitation of rechargeable batteries in electric cars and in point of fact if fuel cells to power essentially electric cars become more than a curiosity (to power the smugness of their owners) they will NOT be hydrogen fueled fuel cells.

there are other fuels that can be used to make fuel cells work...
Methane, Methanol, Ethanol (they just require different membrane
materials) and all have one enormous advantage over hydrogen...
They are "storeable" in useful quantities.
Methanol and ethanol obviously as room temperature liquids
and Methane as a compressed gas.

Hydrogen is attractive as rocket fuel because of the actual "simpliticy" in the primary structure of a rocket...
In essence a Rocket is a giant metal balloon filled with fuel and oxidizer with a rocket motor at one end.

Yes they are hideously complex in the details, but those details account for a nearly trivial percentage of the total lift weight.
The weight of the fuel ammounts to the vast majority of the total takeoff weight.

On an automobile the fuel weight is trivial.
Even in the rather extreem case of my Ranger with
it's 83gallon fuel capacity the total weight of fuel is
still only ~500lb that's only about 10% of the total weight of my truck (Max Gross)

The bulk taken up by fuel? with the typical 20gallon
fuel capacity in say... a Ford Taurus that would require
a 120gallon fuel tank (plus necissary insulation) simply
to have the same range as with gasoline.

Say "Goodbye" to your trunk capacity.
No not most of your trunk capacity ALL
of your trunk capacity.

It's either that of fuel stops MUCH more frequently

Then add the complication that the hydrogen is going to boil off
even if the car isn't being driven.....

So once again I will say (to all the hydrogen true believers):

Hydrogen? Don't be an F'ing idiot!

AD
 
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James Denton

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Been here ---and done-this----All iI can tail you is it does work-Built three of the hho units-----they running anywhere from 3 more miles to the gallon to 4 1/2 miles----That's know:bsflag:---Just telling it like it is.You build you one and see what you get.Most of the talk I heard about the one I built----came from the ones that had never built one themselfs.
 

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