propane injection - diy?


PetroleumJunkie412

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Aside from that, I haven't experimented with fuels other than gasoline yet (I am HORRIBLE at working on diesel; too simple, so they wind up confusing TF out of me).

However, just like with any engine, there are options to control it as a fuel in megasquirt. IIRC, there are options available for propane carburetion with a feedback (I think) carb.

The other option I see for megasquirt is to use a propane carb, and run a MegaSquirt to control spark based on MAP pressures or MAF flow. As long as it can reference rpm and any data on manifold pressures or airflow, then it can at least run a tfi/HEI/EDIS system with very little trouble.

Would make for a nifty hybrid setup with a GM HEI or Ford ignition (have seen megasquirt setups rhat are a TFI/HEI hybrid on jeep) with the megasquirt running everything except fueling, and using the Megasquirt with a Wideband to advance/retard spark based on AFR.

A way later idea with my engine was to screw with coleman propane bottles as an anti detonation agent and as an "aw sh*t I'm out of gas" back-up system. Coleman Lantern bottles would be much easier and more reliable to carry than an extra can of gas, and I like the "shtf" factor. Plus the anti detonation properties are awesome.

Guy next door has a drag semi named Alley Cat that injects propane with his nitrous shots to keep from detonating fuel while racing. I'll ask what he's using for injection. Till then:


 


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ExploreNW

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Forkies/skids/etc used indoors in warehouses almost always run propane. Those little Japanese forklifts all have a Nissan or 'Yota 4-banger in there hooked to a propane carb & points distributor. Very shade tree friendly and they dont stink. AFAIK they mount right up to a 1bbl or 2bbl flange based on model. Find a heavy equip junkyard for a cheap one or a parts dealer on ebay, used LP carbs are just as good as new ones because there's no varnish to build up or corrosive ethanol.

Heck while you're at it grab a couple of forky tanks and mount one on each side of the frame rail. Rig em up in a day & hit the road. No EEC needed (unless you want timing on your '91/'94 then just get an MSD or megasquirt) and no cats needed. I used to live in a state that just tail pipe sniff tested everything pre-96 so I wouldn't worry about the law man either :icon_cheers:
 

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Thanks for the input.
But I want to try injection. Carbs are on the way out (still) and if I'm going to learn about propane I want it to be somewhat applicable to vehicles newer than mid 80's. Its a learning experience that I'm looking for. I get to play with propane injection and learn a little about programming ecu's, which will be applicable to gasoline too.
I have/had a couple of trucks on propane and have saved all the propane systems off them before they go to the scrapper, just in case I need them for a high compression, cammmed to the nuts, duel carb torque monster 460. I have the welders and knowledge to make my own intakes too. Just need time and a place. So many things I want to do.....not enough time.
 

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Found this;

"The guy I was referring to was Dave Bennet. He lived in Minnesota in the USA. Dave developed a system in the mid 90's on Fords where he used the OEM ECU. He installed a special tank from sleegers with an electric pump to maintain a consistent delivery pressure. He also developed a special delivery line with an inner and outer fuel delivery system. Fuel ran to the engine on the inner line and back to the tank on an outer sleeve around the inner line. This kept the fuel temperature down on the return line reducing heat build up. He then developed special injectors using the Ford rail that fit directly into the factory openings but rejetted the injectors to suit liquid propane. The system was designated as Liquid Propane Electronic Fuel Injection or LPEFI. Eventually he sold the rights to a company called Schwans, a rural food delivery company running GM topkicks with 366 and 454 CI engines. They added onto his design to develop it for their trucks. Unfortunately when Schwans decided to try to market it the system would have required a retail price of approximately 12K Canadian. Unmarketable. As far as I know they did use it for inhouse conversions. Sounds unreasonable but Schwans had thousands of trucks throughout the US and Canada saved a fortune using propane and Natural gas and of course the inhouse price was substantially less."
 

PetroleumJunkie412

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Found this
"The guy I was referring to was Dave Bennet. He lived in Minnesota in the USA. Dave developed a system in the mid 90's on Fords where he used the OEM ECU. He installed a special tank from sleegers with an electric pump to maintain a consistent delivery pressure. He also developed a special delivery line with an inner and outer fuel delivery system. Fuel ran to the engine on the inner line and back to the tank on an outer sleeve around the inner line. This kept the fuel temperature down on the return line reducing heat build up. He then developed special injectors using the Ford rail that fit directly into the factory openings but rejetted the injectors to suit liquid propane. The system was designated as Liquid Propane Electronic Fuel Injection or LPEFI. Eventually he sold the rights to a company called Schwans, a rural food delivery company running GM topkicks with 366 and 454 CI engines. They added onto his design to develop it for their trucks. Unfortunately when Schwans decided to try to market it the system would have required a retail price of approximately 12K Canadian. Unmarketable. As far as I know they did use it for inhouse conversions. Sounds unreasonable but Schwans had thousands of trucks throughout the US and Canada saved a fortune using propane and Natural gas and of course the inhouse price was substantially less."
Hua. I have a Schwans truck graveyard near my shop. Ima see if I can get stuff now.
 

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Older tractors start on propane gas and then switch to liquid after they warm up, I have never been around one as they are both incredibly ugly (fuel tanks sticking out) and rather spooky.

They never have paint on them, even the die hards that still run them are scared to park them in their shed out of fear they leak and a spark sends the shed into a low orbit.
 

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So injection it is! You'll still want a couple forky tanks. They're set up to pull liquid off the tank rather than gaseous propane. Not sure what the law is regarding how much gas you can carry there but its around 100lb (24 US gal) here. Could be per-tank, could be per-vehicle.

These guys sell the injectors and a lot of the other parts you'll need at reasonable prices.

If you like cobbling junkyard parts, I remembered the school buses and a few commercial trucks back when I lived in Portland all ran LP. You could take a look under the hood in any west coast junkyard (especially in BC, holy mother of gas prices) but I'm not sure if the heavy duty motors were gas conversions or diesels, or how they worked.

Megasquirt supports LP too. You could also write your own code for an Arduino microcontroller if you speak C++ fluently enough.
 

PetroleumJunkie412

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Megasquirt supports LP too. You could also write your own code for an Arduino microcontroller if you speak C++ fluently enough.
X2 on the arduino thing. Simon Monk's two books teach enough to tackle damn near anything with one. Google speeduino if you want to look over how.to.turn one into an ecm.
 


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